Miscellaneous thoughts and facts while we await tonight's game:
"I played against him, and when you look at third basemen, he was the best third baseman of his era," said Morgan, the Hall of Fame second baseman and ESPN broadcaster. "I thought that's the way you judged it. Every year I voted for Maury Wills and Ron Santo. Those are my first two guys. To me, they were both a no-brainer."Well, Maury Wills isn't really a Hall of Famer, but again, if Morgan can help get Santo over the top next winter and into the Hall, good for him.
Micah Hoffpauir's left-handed bat is a valuable asset with Daryle Ward out, but, like Ward, the rookie is not good enough defensively to play left or right field on a regular basis. Hoffpauir looked tentative on a few balls that landed in front of him on the artificial turf at Tropicana Field, and he didn't start over the weekend against the Sox.I could have told Lou that after watching him play "tentative" in the outfield during spring training. The article goes on to say that Hoffpauir could be trade bait. He doesn't really have much value, so if Jim Hendry can deal him, more power to Hendry.
When posting at this blog, please follow this one simple rule: Before hitting "post" to post your remarks, ask yourself: "Would I be embarrassed to say this in front of strangers who were physically present in the room with me and could respond to my face?" If the answer is "yes," then don't post. BCB encourages and welcomes all opinions, no matter how strong; however, personal attacks, vulgarity, and other uncivilized forms of expression are not welcome. Thanks.I don't think that kind of civility is too much to ask. Thanks again. Let's win tonight.
0 recs | 427 comments
First!
Sorry, never got to do that before. Go Cubs!
jdb-44 - June 24, 2008
2nd is the new first
times are changing ma’aan! I hope this is the year for Santo and the Cubs.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
"other uncivilized forms of expression"
That must mean political expression! :)
jcg996 - June 24, 2008
Is it possible...
...knowing Joe Morgan, that he’s thinking of someone else when he talks about Santo?
SplintChesthair - June 24, 2008
Santa?
HectorVillanueva - June 24, 2008
Game Threads
While I haven’t been in them much this year, in the past they typically do get a little rowdy. The main reason I stay out of the game threads now is actually because they load extremely slow and it takes forever to scroll to the bottom of the page once there is about 150 comments or so.
adam316 - June 24, 2008
Game Threads
When I’m at work, I have no issues. On my laptop at home, extremely slow. When it’s that slow I go to my profile and shut off the live update feature. Then I just refresh as I used to do on the old site. I do find I’ve gotten used to the live update though. It’s a lovely feature when not in game threads.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Maury Wills ?!!!!!
This Maury Wills? Is he serious?
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Apparently so.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
maury wills and his beautiful career .660 ops
give him a little credit did steal 100 bases one season aside of that I have no clue what Joe Morgan is thinking.
cubs - June 24, 2008
Agreed.
He held the SB record for 13 years. That’s about his only distinction. (He was a bad manager, too.)
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Having lived through
his managerial career I can only say that calling him a bad manager is an understatement. Very diplomatic of you, Al.
bubbamike the one and only - June 24, 2008
Wow, longest sig line ever.
Nice gesture, though. R.I.P George Carlin.
daver - June 24, 2008
That's what I thought.
But I, and probably everyone else, read it.
Didn’t know it was Carlin, though. Nice gesture.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Well............
..........he did sire Bump Wills!!
tville - June 24, 2008
Ooops...
didn’t see your post…lol..
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
He did father Bump..
for what that’s worth..
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
Are we talking about your dad?
Because now I am all kinds of confused
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Check here............
http://www.baseball-reference.com/w/willsbu01.shtml
...........for more background.
tville - June 24, 2008
I know
i was trying to be funny. obviously i failed… again.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Well, at least you've learned something.
And learning is half the battle.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
LOL...
I get it….Well played cubbiegirl..:) Should I change my name to Bump Jr.?
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
well at least someone laughed
:-)
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Good, But Not HoF
If Wills had won 3 more Gold Gloves, had about 400 more hits, or walked 400 more times than he did, you could make a case for him. If he had stolen about 200 more bases, you could make a case for him. He simply does not have the numbers for the HoF.
memphiscub - June 24, 2008
Not even...
If we added in the stats of Bump and the other 4 Wills’ to ever play MLB to Maury’s would he be HOF worthy.
BartlettBob - June 24, 2008
This and That
First, who are these sources that indicate Hendry has the big green light? Al, are these sources, the same that said the Cubs wouldn’t get a certain 2B’er from a certain team that just happens to be in ChiTown today?
Second, Joe (I think I’m perfect) Morgan is leading the way for Ronnie? Who’d-a-thunk-it? I saw that article this morning and could not believe me eyes. I do have to wonder how paring down the vote from “up to 10 out of 20-25” to “up to 4 out of 10” really improves Ronnie’s chances of getting into the exclusive-this-is-our-tree-house-and-you’re-not-invited-club. I’m skeptical and won’t believe it until Ronnie gets the call. It’s just the HoF’s way of screwing something up, you know like the Negro league heros. Yeah, vote all these guys in – decades late – then “forget” Buck O’Neil…
Third, what’s with the game threads and larger posts in general? It’s like this new site is waaaaaayyyyy slower than the old one when the number of posts gets into the hundreds.
blackhawk24 - June 24, 2008
Nope, not the same sources.
But the sources that told be about TTSNBN not happening turned out to be correct.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Dude that second paragraph about green-lighting Hendry...
...sent a few shivers down my spine, not gonna lie. Al’s been talking about the whole year, but clearly this year is different. From a 25 year old, I feel like this is how our team SHOULD feel damn near every year – like the championship is ours for the taking. But apparently management hasn’t felt the same throughout the years. Either way, I’m glad that those in charge recognize that we have something special here.
Dan
dtpollitt - June 24, 2008
If true
I would stop thinking Zell to be the root of all evil, and just consider him the root of most evil
cocknfire - June 24, 2008
What's the cash cap?
What is the maximum amount of cash that can be dealt between teams in a trade without a waiver from the Commish (a commish who I dare say would love the Brewers to get CC)? That’s the biggest chip the Cubs have. Honestly, what in our farm system could possibly appeal to the Tribe for CC?
Goat Whisperer - June 24, 2008
You know..
if the Indians were prepared to allow time for a contract extension on a Sabathia trade, I’d say not much. However, if they’re going to stand firm on not allowing it - making C.C. a rental - then I would think a number of scenarios could come into play. Off the top of my head, I’d imagine that Jose Ceda and Jose Ascanio would be a nice starting point for conversation.
Damen Jackson - June 24, 2008
You're exactly right on the first point
if there is no negotiation window, the Cubs have a lot better chance of getting C.C. I don’t think Ceda and Ascanio are enough to start the coversation. I think Gallagher starts the conversation.
DGU - June 24, 2008
I wonder though
Even the rental price has high—more than the compensation picks they’d receive just for holding on to him until the end of the year.
Goat Whisperer - June 24, 2008
ugh
“has to be”
Goat Whisperer - June 24, 2008
Zell knows
a winner brings a higher price than a loser. He didn’t make all that money being a fool.
bubbamike the one and only - June 24, 2008
Zell probably knows the old addage of
you have to spend money to make money. It would seem to be pretty appropriate here.
gwood - June 24, 2008
Random question...
...regarding Hoffpauir specifically, but all players generally:
How hard is it to “practice” and thus “improve” your fielding? I mean, we regularly see guys take batting practice, hit off a tee, do video study of opposing pitchers and their own swing….but what does a guy do to improve his fielding from a practical standpoint?
I mean, you could hit him flyballs, but that only works if you’re not hitting them TO him, but rather someplace away from him so he has to play it like real game conditions, right? Is it as easy as just having Hoffpauir shag balls in the outfield during batting practice, pretending each ball hit is under “real” game conditions? That way he tries to get a jump on the ball, dive or play if off a hop, and get it into the proper cutoff man?
Just something I was wondering…it just seems easier for infielders to practice groundball fielding and turning double plays that it does for outfielders to get “real” practice.
Chadnudj - June 24, 2008
Being an athlete
You either are or you aren’t. He’s obviously athletic but he doesn’t have the same level of natural talent and skill that would allow him to improve dramatically such as a Rick Ankiel. How does that guy go from being a SP to a starting CF with good speed, pop and a cannon of an arm to throw out baserunners? He’s a good athlete.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Plus...
... he’s 28 years old, and very unlikely to develop this sort of skillset at that age, with no experience, and to thrust him into a starting OF slot on a pennant contender is really unfair, both to him and to the team.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Anybody can shag fly balls.
You can do it all day long. Hit right to you, to your left, to your right, from sun up to sun down. But there’s little things you pick up that, as Al said, a 28 year old is probably too old to learn now. Things like reading the ball off the bat so you can get a jump, knowing your pitcher’s arsenal and what pitch he’s likely to throw in different counts to different types of hitters and where those hitters are likely to place the ball. Fundamentals and raw talent are key to this game.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
+1
Reading the ball off the bat ASAP is soooooooooooooo important. Knowing your pitcher, also important. I still do that do this day – at my age – in 16” softball in CF, even at 1B.
blackhawk24 - June 24, 2008
There is a certain level of physical talent that no amount of learning will replace.
Hoffpauir can’t learn how to be a more athletic runner or have a stronger arm.
cwyers - June 24, 2008
The best outfielders
are instinctive. You can work on improving your reads of fly balls, but if you don’t have the instincts you won’t be a good outfielder.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Word.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Outfielders +1
Anyone can catch a ball hit at you, but there seems to be so much movement on the balls lately its the gappers and down the line that would eat him up.
MH swings a good bat and would be an asset to most teams off the bench or in the AL as a DH.
I hear MH is a big R&R fan, would love to play in Cleveland. ( ???)
parrotinct - June 24, 2008
My wife could practice driving all day long and.....
well I think you know the rest
gocubsgo22 - June 24, 2008
+1
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
Thanks for encouraging some civility Al
There were a few FanPosts yesterday as well that turned into personal bashing sessions. Let’s talk baseball and just ignore comments that we don’t like eh? No need to post a put down everytime someome you don’t like adds a comment. Ok, i’m done. Go Cubs.
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
+1
DGU - June 24, 2008
Smugness Is Ugly
Nothing ruins a baseball forum or blog more than condescension and holier-than-thou attitudes. This one is unique in that it’s mature, good-natured, and populated by people that don’t take themselves too seriously. Please let’s keep it that way! For my part I am steering clear of game threads where I’m apt to turn into said douchenozzle.
CaliCub - June 24, 2008
+1
I’ve taken a game-thread break myself, though I do sometimes read them the next day, which has lead me to notice an interesting occurrence: a couple of the nastier posters, who are usually only around during losses and/or meltdowns, seem to come back in the thread a couple hours after the game, once most everyone’s gone, and post multiple snarky replies. Classy.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Yeah, they have been a tad mean lately...
...but honestly, what’s to complain about when we are 20 games up? Not much, at least in my eyes.
Dan
dtpollitt - June 24, 2008
Yep.
This season has been great thus far, for sure.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Blue Mike will find something
He always does
Doggie Stalker - June 24, 2008
yes but...
lately Blue Mike will post a comment that isn’t controversial… and people will still feel the need to bash his posts, just cause they don’t like him. that makes for sucky threads IMHO
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
Well said Ben
I haven’t said anything but to be honest it’s been gettting mighty old
carolinacub - June 24, 2008
+1
Maybe the dictionary needs to be updated with the word “ignore.”
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Since this is the "Stuff That Doesn't Fit Anywhere Else" Post
via Deadspin, The most succinct take on Mariotti I’ve ever seen:
Game. Set. Match. Winner.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
That Was SPOT ON
Great stuff Gary. I’ve thought the same of Jim Rome – does he really like the field he’s covering or just using it for self-aggrandization?
CaliCub - June 24, 2008
Rome's different case, IMO.
He loves sports because it’s serves as a vehicle for his enormous ego. He’s guy that realizes his luck and his situation and uses both very well. I think he likes sports, but hates athletes.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Rome is all about Rome
Just like a ‘shock-jock’ he says whatever he needs to say to get attention, which equals cash. Show biz, folks. Please don’t believe ANY talk show host, be it sports or political actually believes everything he or she says. Conflict = ratings (or circulation, in the newspaper biz) = money.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - June 24, 2008
Since this is about a little bit of everything...
Reed Johnson is probably going to the DL retroactive to June 17 with “back stiffness.” He was scheduled to appear (as he does every week) on the Mike North Morning Show on 670 AM in Chicago, however did not call him. RJ is the likely candidate to be sent to the DL in order to bring up Sean Marshall to fill in for Zambrano while he is on the DL. Reed was probably not very happy about Hendry moving him to the DL, however this fulfills a few needs…
-Too many outfielders… needed to get rid of one
-Eric Patterson has been playing well, and can play center, or left and fill in for Soriano if needed late in a game
-Much needed left handed started finally on the team who has looked good at AAA
Hopefully this is all temporary, Marshall produces, Reed isn’t hurt that bad, and we keep this streak alive!
lswaidz - June 24, 2008
It's probably a good idea...
... considering RJ had back surgery a year ago. Why risk further injury if the team is winning and there’s a suitable temporary replacement?
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
has anyone heard about the roster moves for sure?
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
If RJ goes DL
does the platoon in CF become
v.RHP
LF Patterson
CF Edmonds
RF Dome
v. LHP
LF Murton
CF Dome
RF DeRo
Or will Edmonds get a shot to hit v. LHP?
DGU - June 24, 2008
I quite
game threads over a year ago. It’s just not worth weathering the knee-jerk reactions and idiotic behavior of so many. I don’t care about the language or anything particular, I just think those ledgejumpers and haters ruin my enjoyment of just following the game’s progress. I usually get off BCB and just follow the game via MLB or Yahoo while emailing with a friend or two that are doing the same thing.
Kegler - June 24, 2008
(This reply belongs above) Re: Maury Wills
I really do believe that merit for HOF candidacy should go beyond the stat sheet, so if Joe Morgan thinks Wills was a special player, more power to him. Take Andre Dawson for example. I constantly find myself trying to defend his candidacy based on his cannon arm alone, but people just want to look at his bbref page and disregard anything beyond the numbers.
Jerry Mumphrey - June 24, 2008
Dawson's career numbers...
... in the context of his era, were far better than Wills’ in the context of his.
You do have to look at Wills’ numbers in the context of the 1960’s, a very low-offense era, and that he played many years with Dodger Stadium, an extreme pitcher’s park in those days, as his home park.
The .720 OPS he put up in 1962 doesn’t look very good to us, but it was at least league-average then.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
It is nice to see Morgan making the context point.
That’s going to become increasingly important aspect of HOF voting, given the inflated numbers of the so-called “steroid era” and the slight offensive drop-off we’ve begun to see coming out of it.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Also the SB...
he played in an era when the SB wasn’t as prominent as it was in the ‘70s and ‘80s, but he led the league in SB every year from ‘60-’65, and was top 4 in SB from ‘66‘69. He has an MVP award as well.
He probably would be considered more of the “fame” argument for his baserunning, and he probably is overrated based on the fact that OBP was largely ignored back then in favor of AVG, and as Al said he played in a park and in an era that deflated his stats.
SouthernCub - June 24, 2008
It also helps to understand
that shortstop was not considered an offensive position then but a defensive one. The two top shortstops of that generation were Aparicio and Wills, neither one of whom were real offensive threats except on the basepaths. Also they transformed the game and made speed a factor, a movement away from the three run homerun theory of baseball.
bubbamike the one and only - June 24, 2008
Gold Gloves
Maury Wills did win 2 Gold Gloves, but Aparicio won 9. Those 9 Gold Gloves along with Aparicio’s steals have gotten him into the HoF. Had Wills won 5 Gold Gloves to go along with Maury’s steals, he would have more HoF credibility. I believe Dawson’s 8 Gold Gloves should be taken into consideration for his HoF bid. IMO, that should make up for the low OBP of the Hawk. However, more than 25% of the HoF voters evidently disagree with me.
memphiscub - June 24, 2008
I'm surprised by two things--Morgan and Micha
My understanding had always been that Morgan was a leader in NOT voting for Ron Santo and maybe even in increasing sentiment agaisnt him…if what’s posted here is true, then I can forgive a multitude of Joe’s sins.
I disagree with the analysis that Hoffpauir has very little trade value. I suppose it’s a relative term since he’s not really a power hitter and really is either a DH or 1B…..but I see a REAL good team in Anaheim featuring a starting 1B with a very similar skill set. There should be a slot for Micah in the AL, the man can hit, he’s lefty and he’s a pretty fair glove at first.
cubfever7 - June 24, 2008
Morgan
I don’t know how much honesty there was there, but Morgan made some complimentary comments and talked openly about the Hall of Fame credentials of Santo in This Old Cub. That movie was four years ago, so Morgan has been promoting Ronny for at least that long.
HectorVillanueva - June 24, 2008
I know Hoff seems a lot like Kotchman at first glance,
but, one, Kotchman is 25, and broke in at 23; Hoff is 28 and broke in at 28. Also, check out their minor league numbers:
Kotchman, minors, career (5 seasons): .325/.401/.493/.894
Hoff, minors, career (6 seasons): .281/.338/.453/.791
Kotchman projects to be a better hitter than Hoff, and he’s also three years younger, which is a factor that just cannot be ignored.
That said, I do think Hoff has some value to an AL team, maybe Seattle, who are done with Richie Sexson, or Cleveland, who will need some one to alternate 1B/DH duties with Garko while Hafner is out.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
There's really no point...
... for Seattle to trade for Hoffpauir. They’re done this year and though I haven’t looked, I’d guess they have to have a 1B/DH in their own system who’s at least as good, if not better.
Cleveland, again—what do they gain?
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Maybe you're right about Seattle,
but Cleveland gains a stopgap until Hafner gets back, if he gets back. He jsut a setback in his rehab, according to Yahoo! Sports, so they may be looking for a guy like Hoffpauir. I’m not saying Hoff is going to draw interest on his own, but as part of a package of players, there would be some value there for an AL team, given the DH possibility. Seattle is desperate to add power, even doubles-only power, because they’re not getting squat from Sexson or Vidro, and Cleveland will need someone to spell Garko. They’ve been using Blake and Martinez, but those guys need a rest once in a while, too, as they have their own full time positions.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Yeah, it'd have to be as part of a package.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
You think Cleveland would consider C.C. for Hoff and Marshall or Gallagher
I’d hate to part with Gallagher or even Marshall, but if one of them, Hoff and a prospect or two would get us C.C., it might be worth it. (I would assume they’d want an arm to replace C.C. ....)
cocknfire - June 24, 2008
They're pretty stocked on pitching
They need offense.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
How about Theriot!
KIDDING!
Kinky Reggae - June 24, 2008
How 'bout Pie?
[/sarcasm, lest anyone doubt]
cocknfire - June 24, 2008
Yeah, "he sucks".
Someone should make a fanpost about this….j/k, j/k…
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
HA!
Right?
Kinky Reggae - June 24, 2008
Consider? Sure. Do? No.
You’re going to have to either outbid the other contenders’ farm systems or come up with something better than what Cleveland thinks they can get with the two high draft picks they would get if CC leaves as free agent.
And IMO, I think Cleveland puts a pretty high value on their own scouts and farm system, so I think they’d be perfectly happy to roll the dice, ride CC for the whole season, and get the two draft picks.
You’re going to have to WOW them to get CC at deadline. And for the Cubs, WOW means somebody like Marmol, or Soto. And Hendry won’t do that. and he shouldn’t.
ballhawk - June 24, 2008
I agree if it takes Marmol or Soto
I don’t know, I was just thinking out loud, I guess. It’s hard to come up with something that doesn’t give away all our top prospects that would be appealing enough to get him.
I’m not saying we shouldn’t give up some of the farm—I’m all for that. Just not too much of it.
cocknfire - June 24, 2008
CC for Hoff and Gallagher or Marshall
I’m pretty sure that Cleveland would laugh Jim Hendry out of their office with that proposal.
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
Cleveland is not the Pirates...
but we laugh pretty hard now about the Lofton/Raimrez trade(steal).
MikeOxbyg - June 24, 2008
Seattle
Just wanted to add that Seattle is rumored to be taking a look at Jojihma (sp), their former catcher,, at first if they do indeed release or trade Sexson. I believe Jojihma’s(sp) deal was 3 yrs. at $24 million and he’s played his way out from behind the plate this year.
Cleveland is an interesting option for Hoff, especially with C.C.’s name being thrown around
Tangled Up In Blue - June 24, 2008
No to both
Morgan has always supported Santo’s candidacy as he’s supported most big stars of the 1960s (see Wills, Maury). I think he also supports Gil Hodges
And comparing Hoffpauir to Casy Kotchman is wrong. First, Kotchman is three years younger than Hoffpauir. Secondly, I don’t think Hoffpauir would hit .300 over a full season in the majors like Kotchman.
The problem with Hoffpauir’s trade value is that every team has a guy like him. A career slugger who can’t play any position other than first base. The only thing he’s got going for him is that he’s left-handed. Heck, other than him being right-handed, we’ve got a second Micah Hoffpauir in the minors with Jake Fox.
Too many “Hoffpauirs” on the market for Micah to have much, if any, value.
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
The best current comparison is
Jack Cust. A long term minor league guy that could hit, but not good enough in the field. He finally signed with an AL team in need of a DH and he has some success. Even though Cust tore through AAA pitching, teams couldn’t find a home for him.
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
But Hoffpauir isn't Cust
Cust was putting up OBP well over .400 and knocking out 25-30 HR a year in the minors for five seasons in AAA. Hoffpauir’s OBP was in the .350 and he could never stay healthy enough to hit 25-30 HRs in a minor league season.
So Hoffpauir is a poor man’s Jack Cust. And think of all the trouble Jack Cust has had getting and keeping a major league job.
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
agreed.
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
Surely someone will take a flier on...
Hoff, since he’s hit pretty well while he’s been up. He’s not an outfielder, but he might be a decent DH or 1B for someone.
My concern is we get rid of him and then DWard continues to struggle as he has most of this season.
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
Exactly
spare parts are sometimes just that but Hoff is a pretty valuable left handed bat to have waiting in the wings. Like you said if Ward would get hurt again and we trade Hoff, who is our next left handed specialist?
mrcubsfan - June 24, 2008
Great point
Best moves “sometime’s” are the ones you don’t make
parrotinct - June 24, 2008
Al are you responsible for banning or is SBNation?
Eamus-Catuli was way over the line the other day and I’m sure got many complaints and yet was on the next day’s thread.
Just wondering what the protocol is. Warning first?
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
I have received no complaints about him.
If anyone has any, I need to hear about it directly. Send specific links.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
I flagged him too
I’ll see if I can dig up the links for you
Emelie - June 24, 2008
Not sure if this goes directly to his comments....
http://www.bleedcubbieblue.com/2008/6/19/554776/overflow-thread-2-cubs-vs#6866579
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
wow
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Those comments are very nice...
I know i appreciate them! Thanks Eamus!
Kinky Reggae - June 24, 2008
that thread is hilarious and disturbing at the same time
there are a lot of crazy people on here during Cubs losses.
joeschmitt - June 24, 2008
I know I flagged a few eamus-catuli posts a few days ago...
along with a few others… it was a nasty thread the 3rd game in Tampa Bay…
lswaidz - June 24, 2008
i flagged several ones of his
they were all way over the line.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
FYI...
... I just saw all the flags. He’s been warned. If it happens again he’ll be banned.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
I didn't know you needed to be emailed
to know about this, i thought as admin you’d get notified about the flags. I’ll keep that in mind in case it happens again. :-)
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Yeah, I was wondering that myself
What’s the point of flagging if no one sees it?
John Q Freejazz - June 24, 2008
I guess I need to take a look at those more often.
I can see them, but I don’t get an automatic notification.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
There was a bunch of additional garbage at the end of that thread
if you’re bored later, Al, feel free to take a look… make sure there’s no kids in the room though, it gets a little nasty
lswaidz - June 24, 2008
Al, two FYI's
First, on the small issue of Joe Morgan, I got a personal email back from the person I BCC’d you yesterday and it basically stated in part; “thanks…duly noted and forward…the outcry by your fellow Cub fans was heard”. —MAY I SUGGEST THAT ANYONE WHO WANTS TO SHOULD CONTINUE TO SPEAK OUT TO THE ESPN COMPLAINT LINK IN THE FAN POSTS. Keep it civil, keep to the facts specific to Morgan’s ongoing characterization’s and story telling. My thinking is that the Cub organization is not too pleased either.
As for the bigger issue: Spending for a WS caliber roster. Cubs are at $120M which is roughly $20M or so below the East Coast level of WS perennial contenders. My thinking is that the Cubs probably have three players or roles they could add, two on the margins and one key player to have possibly the best playoff roster in ‘08.
Margins: Infield utility player, switch-hitting veteran bat off the bench, outstanding glove=Omar Vizquel. He is somewhat expensive but after the All Star break he will cost less than $3M for 2.5 months or less and he will not qualify for the automatic option in ‘09. Acquiring him will not be terribly expensive and he could solve the late inning defensive need at SS. My guess is that this might only cost the Cubs Murton and a Advanced A player of mid-level prospect status.
#2 Late-inning LOOGY Rumor had it that the CO ROX might be willing to part with LHP Fuentes the sling-shot lefty who made the All Star squad last year. He is a free agent and he also could be had for the right price lets say for a Cotts.
On par this might be overspending but to close up any weakness, especially short series or situational late game tactics this could add a lot to the club’s chances.
Key Player: Naturally this is the top of the rotation starter in the same vernacular as what Schilling, Alexander, Cone, Sutcliffe or Johnson did in respective years. To me analogy is falls on Schilling & Johnson’s experiences when Schilling went to AZ or Johnson went to Houston, both near the top of the games and during the mid seasons. Thinking through the scenario’s in both cases those players that were traded were did not become huge stars. That said who is the prime target? CC Sabathia of course but Oakland will be serving up Harden and Toronto dealing AJ Burkett. Cubs will have to overpay dearly for CC in that the Yankees, RedSox, Dodgers, Rays and possibly Cards and Brewers might be seeking to deal. That all said Sabathia is the player that puts the Cubs in the best roster position, the other two or three are good deals, less costly but killer app’s. So what will it take? My best guess looking at the other trades as the price and the inflation of contending teams.
Gallagher (no doubt), E Patterson (ready now), Colvin (Pie is hurt and a project), then two others, Donnie Veal (top level prospect) and Ceda (a final top level prospect) and the last two replace the lost FA draft choices. CC’s salary pro-rated would be like Vizquel’s and ultimately would put the Cubs at around $130M
Ivy Walls - June 24, 2008
Glad to hear about the Morgan comments.
Maybe we’ll get somewhere.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Persistance pays off.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
It was frustrating to read in yesterdays recap thread,
some unwillingness by others to even try. We HAVE to speak up.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Gallagher, EPat, Colvin, Veal, and Ceda seems an awful lot
....for a 3 month pitcher, especially when Cleveland says they won’t allow any team to negotiate with Sabathia for a contract extension. Or did you mean some combination of this list?
I don’t know how we get rid of Gallagher. Too much upside, in my opinion.
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
I agree completely
I don’t want to sell the farm to get a veteren pitcher. Especially with the way baseball is trending toward youth.
If we can get a good deal, thats fine. But with as awful as the AL Central is, I don’t think Cleveland is going to be out of it for a long time, if at all.
I think the trade deadline’s going to be pretty bare, unless you want to go after Bedard. And everything I’ve heard about Bedard is that he’s a headcase who likes to take himself out of games. Plus Seattle gave up a LOT to get him, they’re going to want to restock their system.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
I've heard that too about Bedard.
Clubhouse cancer, struggles to go more than 5 innings. Haven’t we seen enough of his ilk?
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
You'd think so
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
I wouldn't give up all our top prospects for a "rent-a-pitcher" like Sabathia.
And who knows, Cleveland is just 6.5 games out of first and may want to keep him longer. Same holds true for Harden and Oakland. Burnette might be available, but he doesn’t seem to be much of an improvement on what we already have. As for Fuentes, no how, no way. I’d as soon have Cotts or Eyre as him. He’s been just as shaky as either of them.
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
Fuentes
... Fuentes has been pretty good this season. I’d love to see him in the Cubs’ pen. Are you sure you aren’t thinking about Manny Corpas?
Goat Whisperer - June 24, 2008
Fuentes
has downright nasty stuff when he’s on. But with the D-bags slide even the Rockies aren’t that far out of the race… they aren’t going to give him up yet.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Perhaps...
I was just remembering his 4 consecutive blown saves last year. You’re right, he is having a pretty good season this year. If he can be had, why not?
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
There was a report
from Ken Rosenthal that the Cubs were interested in Brian Fuentes, but he corrected himself a day later and said he had made a mistake. (A refreshing admission from Robothal. That’s why he’s the best these days.) But it sounds like Bump didn’t get the correction.
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
I was only replying to Ivy Walls comment above...
I didn’t know if he was available or not. However, that is refreshing indeed to hear that Rosenthal corrected himself. I’ve always liked him too.
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
Noooooooooo!
Not Daisy Fuentes!!!
Lou In Blue - June 24, 2008
Yes! Daisy Fuentes!!!
Oh, you mean pitching?!
Blue W - June 24, 2008
I don't think Hendry would make a trade for CC unless he was signed....
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
+1
Hendry will suprise us all & bring in someone who will help us now & in the future.
Probly none of the big names being bantered about hear.
cubbierc - June 24, 2008
We don't need Omar and his cost
but thanks for playing.
bubbamike the one and only - June 24, 2008
If we're going to go hog-wild with spending,
I’d take Dave Roberts off of SF’s hands befor Vizquel. Vizquel looks done to me. Roberts, though, would give us value of a real pinch-runner on the worst-case end and on the best-case end, he and Reed Johnson could potentially platoon in CF with the small grounds in Wrigley. (I wouldn’t play him over the Edmonds we are seeing now, but Edmonds is fragile at this stage of his career.)
DGU - June 24, 2008
So the "actions" part of the site goes directly to SBNation?
I’ll look up some links….
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
No, it goes to his profile.
But unless I hear about it, I wouldn’t necessarily look up any specific profile.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
I got the links.
Thanks. This will be taken care of.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Thanks Al
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
Thanks a bunch, Al.
slcathena - June 24, 2008
I was at the Sunday game..
And it was Dotel and Ozzie’s son playing catch. After they were done playing catch, Dotel acted like he was going to throw it to the RF bleachers, than the LF bleachers and ran off with the ball, acting like a tease.
He then got to the foul line and made a gesture that you see in the bedroom..
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
I saw all of that.
From the LF corner it looked like Ozzie. Thanks for the details.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Ya, I was surprised.
And Al, you were at the Friday game I assume, right?
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
Yes, I was. Why?
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Security
Did security do anything about the WS fans throwing trash on the field after the Aramis walk-off or the guy jumping into the batters eye?
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
Don't know, because I left fairly quickly.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Wait but did you see the guy shagging balls
who gave us all the finger when running in from the OF on Saturday? That was also classy!
Kinky Reggae - June 24, 2008
WOW
“He then got to the foul line and made a gesture that you see in the bedroom”
For real? Damn, what is up with that team lately???
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
they're classy, huh?
heh.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
As I've said...
... don’t even acknowledge this stuff. That’s what they want. Ignore them. That drives them crazy.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
thats were being the blind one comes in handy
never notice any of that crap.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
I really want to make the t-shirt
from the game thread the other day..
See you next week – we’ll bring the rats – you bring your teeth!
lswaidz - June 24, 2008
I couldn't believe it either.
I guess I shouldn’t be surprised.
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
All this after his 2 gopher balls on Friday.
LOL. Smart guy.
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
It does surprise me though...
I remember how this Crosstown series used to really get (it seemed anyway) into the CUBS players heads and not the other way around. And… even when it did… it only affected their play on the field (unfortunately – lol) and I can’t remember any of the Cubs players pulling some immature crap like I’ve heard about this past weekend. It’s unfortunate.
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
Soriano
We were walking down Mich. Ave and Soriano comes driving by revving his Aston Martin engine. Pretty funny. And Shawn Marion was sitting a rown in front of us, reppin his Cubs hat.
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
When did you see Alfonso on Michigan Ave.?
Just curious—I work near there.
daver - June 24, 2008
Sunday around 1. I was walking to Nike Town.
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
Cool, thanks.
daver - June 24, 2008
He wasn't driving this?
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
Wow
The last game I was at over memorial day weekend, Soriano had his Bently at the game.
gwood - June 24, 2008
Kenny and Ozzie
Do they get a free-pass on what they said after Friday’s loss?
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
Which part? lol
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
Lol.
Everything. Classy organization. Guess that’s where the fans get it from.
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
These guys?
They always get a pass; they’re music legends!
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Haha
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
Ouch - painful historical post
I was actually at the game when Ozzie did the 7th inning. Guy could barely walk up the ramp before killing the song.
What a painful day. I cant even remember if the Cubs won or lost that day
parrotinct - June 24, 2008
Ozzie Osbourne
That clip is still on youtube. Funny stuff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdwOoinuJi0
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
Ozzie is an embarrassment to musicians everywhere.....
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
People actually confuse him with musicians?
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Unfortunately, yes.....
my guitar mags are full of Ozzie…...
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Does he actually play? Can he?
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
He can't even stand up or speak!!
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
They present his songs in tablature form...
but I don’t think many guitarists actually think he is a musician. Most people understand he’s just the vocal front man…Rhodes, Lee, Wylde, and Vai were the guys who madethose songs “go”....
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Exactly.
And don’t forget Tony Iommi—I’ll defend the first five Sabbath albums with my life.
daver - June 24, 2008
Yeah, I guess it's debatable...
...whether he’s a “musician.” He’s worked with some great ones, though.
daver - June 24, 2008
Wating for SWL to pop in..
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
CyberCyclist - June 24, 2008
LAMO
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
LAMO?
Laughing Amongst Many Others? A group thing?
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Something like that
my dog certainly thinks I’m hilarious… although I think she may be the only one.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Laughing Alone (but) Maniacally Outloud
Ha.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
But laughter is better shared.
And you’re never alone on BCB. ;)
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Unless you're blue mike
than you’re always off in LF by yourself.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
NO...he's a 2nd baseman...remember?
I wonder how “scrappy” he was….hmmm.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Wonder if he was the wonder mullet hamster
thing’s predecessor.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
True. Ten points.
Come to think of it, so was Bonds.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Maybe it's punctuated.
Laughing ass, mine, off.
daver - June 24, 2008
Nah. I can't do Yoda
or Yoda I cannot do or whatever.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
What she said, that is.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
wssti
daver - June 24, 2008
And the BCB Dictionary grows.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
ha
bet that’ll be fun to explain… wth does “wssti” mean.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Simply put: the evolution of a stupid joke.
Or, Star Warsification of an Office anti-joke.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
heh
yeah, that’ll clear up everything.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Couldn't be simpler.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Danks
Kids a very good pitcher, but the league should do something about those comments he made.
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
Why?
I’d rather they do some work to ensure consistency among the umpires’ strike zones, stop umps from openly confronting managers and players, and do more to curb fan interference on balls in play. I could care less what the players have to say. Sticks and stones.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Couldn't have said it better
There are bigger issues than policing what players say about parks.
rlpete - June 24, 2008
I agree wholeheartedly.
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Well, I've given a lot of thought to the suspensions handed out by MLB.....
Position players suspensions are measured in days. Pitcher’s are handled the same, 5 days instead of 5 starts. So, why don’t they just make the suspended pitchers punishment something like…..3 starts throwing with the opposite hand!!!!!!
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Hoffpauir
His career minor league numbers are .281./.339/.454. His recent AAA numbers look better because he spent parts of 5 seasons there. He’s a 28-year old 1st baseman.
He is not going to add much value in any trade. Teams are not going to look at 19 major league AB’s and think he is all of a sudden a .300 hitter. Comparing him to Kotchman is ridiculous.
This overrating of him is starting to remind me of the Sam Fuld love-fest last winter.
rlpete - June 24, 2008
+1
Made the same remarks here earlier
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
only you made them more accurately and i daresay more reasonably.
cubfever7 - June 24, 2008
But Fuld
is a triple-threat! He’s scrappy, hunky and Jewish!
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
so is Ben Stiller
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
I'm not sure
Ben is scrappy.
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
Well, he did nail that chick with a volleyball in "Meet the Parents."
daver - June 24, 2008
nor "hunky"
Emelie - June 24, 2008
You can say that again.
daver - June 24, 2008
He's also really, really, good looking.
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
you forgot
ridiculously
gwood - June 24, 2008
charitable too
he’s got a center for kids that can’t read good
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
and he warns us that...
“Anyone can die in a tragic gasoline fight accident”
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
Did you just say "But Fuld"?
Geez, I’m so Immature.
Blue W - June 24, 2008
Jewish and Catholic
They celebrated Christmas and Hanukkah.
sue369 - June 24, 2008
He's had 45 at bats, not 19....
...with 14 hits. 6 doubles. I’ll take any guy off the bench who hits .400, whether he’s a career minor leaguer or not. He’s also 12-27 when he’s STARTED a game. You don’t think a team would take a flier on that?
I wouldn’t call it a love-fest, but you can’t deny he’s contributed and contributed well to this team. Everyone wants to complain that “he’s playing over his head”, but they’re called “career years” for a reason. Lightning in a bottle, baby.
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
He did say
That Wrigley was a s* hole, and that he was bringing his nose plugs to drown the smell of urine.
ARAM FOR MVP - June 24, 2008
Who made the great comment here yesterday...
... about how he should keep his noseclips because the smell of defeat has to be worse than the smell of urine? That was brilliant.
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
That was the best poster ever
Sue
Hammer - June 24, 2008
Meh.
Old ballparks smell. I refuse to take this stuff personally. It’s a ballpark. If he wants to say that stuff, and that’s how he feels, so be it. I’ve never been in the visitor’s clubhouse, so I can’t say he’s wrong, and another guy made much the same observation a couple years ago: Jim Edmonds.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
For guys that work
2/3 of the year and get paid a buttload of money for playing a game, they sure bitch a lot.
Hammer - June 24, 2008
I don't know about you...
but I bitch a lot too….it’s just that my wife doesn’t print in in a newspaper, publish it on the internet, or broadcast it on national TV. Everyone complains.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Everyone poops, too
but you don’t hear me making a big stink of it.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
It's true! I've got the book and everything!
daver - June 24, 2008
That book singlehandedly potty trained my 2 daughters...
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Somewhere in the world there's a guy (or girl)
who, when hearing the phrase “Excuse me, I have to go to the bathroom” can respond with “Tell me about it, I wrote the book on it!”
No, I’m not jealous. Much.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
LOL, mine too!
daver - June 24, 2008
Does the book work for the Elderly?
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
Sure. Or you could try these:
daver - June 24, 2008
I bitch about things all the time
I just bitched about rich guys playing a game bitching. Although, if a microphone was stuffed in my face and would be broadcasted to millions of people and then put into print for millions of more people Id shut my mouth.
Hammer - June 24, 2008
Maybe you would, but maybe you wouldn't hammer
Its not like anything you’re saying here is remotely false.
I remember one of the strikes years ago when the avg salary was ONLY $2M or so a year. One of the guys had the audacity to talke about not being able to plan his retirement if the players were on strike too long. ARE YOU KIDDING ME?
Like Eddie Murphy said once in his standups about someone rich not being able to make ends meet. “You’re rolling in cash, the ends are meeting like a M-F’er”.
blackhawk24 - June 24, 2008
Besides, who gives a rats ass what
any ChiSox player says anyway? It’s imbreeding from all the way at the top, starting with Kenny. See the Mariotti article about him the other day? This is the TEAMS’ GM SAYING THIS SHIT.
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/mariotti/1015873,Mariotti062009.article
If the GM talks smack and the manager is a certifiable loon, the owner is greener than envy, the fan base for the most part is a self-pity party, what else can be expected from the players than that kind of crap? From remarks and antics from Valentin a few years back to the jackass that catches for them now and now the punk that said this…it never stops.
I’m just glad the Cubs organization kept to the high road and hope they continue to do so. The best thing ANY ONE OF US as diehard CUBS FANS can do is totally ignore the goings-on from the junior circuits’ representative 9 miles south. Like my late father used to tell me, “son don’t give them the satisfaction”.
blackhawk24 - June 24, 2008
Yup.
Oh, and we can beat them when we play, too.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Well, it has been historically true, White Sox management
being rotten from the top down. After all, the earliest I can think of is 1919, when Mr. Comiskey failed to pay his players what he promised them, bonuses if they won the pennant. The gambling crowd made sure they got their bonuses…...
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
That may not be true
that’s from “Eight Men Out” and later historians have been unable to find out where Asinof got that information and he didn’t cite it and never explained where he got that from. Essentially, there’s no concrete evidence that Comiskey ever welched on a bonus he’d promised. (The bonus to Cicotte if he won 30 is really shaky—it simply doesn’t fit the facts of Cicotte’s career and salary.)
It could have happened because there is a lot of evidence that Comiskey was a cheapskate of the first order. On the other hand, so was Charles Murphy, who owned the Cubs in the Tinkers-to-Evers-to-Chance days.
Don’t forget though, that Bill Veeck owned the White Sox for a few years.
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
I've never seen "eight men out", tried but found it boring.
Actually got that bit from (can’t cite it because I’ve read a lot about the man!) something on Meyer Lansky….
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
The movie isn't as good as the book.
Read the book.
Al Yellon - June 24, 2008
Isn't that usually the case though.
HectorVillanueva - June 24, 2008
The Devil Wears Prada
Movie much better than the book.
The exception that makes the rule.
bubbamike the one and only - June 24, 2008
OOh, their big bad pitcher
insulted our park. I don’t care. Why does that matter?
He said it to insult us, and I can’t even get a fig about it. He lost thats enough payback for me.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Who cares
Ozzie Guillen is crazy like a fox and says things for affect. It’s his way of motivating his ballclub. I can’t worry about the guy in the other dugout.
MDBNIU - June 24, 2008
very soon
the motivation will wear out, and he’ll be gone. Who cares though right?
tony412 - June 24, 2008
"Edmonds doesn't scare me......
I’ll always pitch to him.” Seems like he walked Edmonds intentionally…...after that was said.
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Not worthy of a fanpost
but I was checking the O’s site in anticipation of tonight’s game and came across this article about everyone’s favorite unmentionable player.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
F.Y.I. on Roberts so far for 2008
BA: .290 / 5 HRs / 29 RBIs / 33 BBs / 51 Ks / OBP: .372
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
Let's go one step further and get it out of the way:
Brian Roberts: .290/.372/.469 (.841 OPS, 125 OPS+), 21 SB
Mark DeRosa: .285/.373/.438 (.811 OPS, 111 OPS+), 3 SB
Anyone having any second thoughts? I must confess, Roberts’ numbers are better than I expected. (Full disclosure: I haven’t been following his performance very closely.)
Nonetheless, I’m guessing Sean Gallagher wouldn’t be on the team right now if the Cubs had, in fact, acquired BRob. So, particularly in light of Rich Hill’s fall into the seventh circle of minor league baseball, I still have no problem with Hendry walking away from this trade. The Cubs offense has been just fine.
daver - June 24, 2008
and our pitching staff
is happy with gallagher, who i really like.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Agreed
someone said it above, the best deals are sometimes those never made. IMO the combination of DeRosa and Gallagher is helping the Cubs win more games than the Cubs would if they had Roberts, but without Gallagher.
gwood - June 24, 2008
I agree.
And with Z going down Hill might’ve been the one called up for these two starts.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
I was for it then when I thought
it was a mechanism to get Soriano out of the leadoff spot. Nothing against DeRo. For his numbers, I sort of expected that level. I just don’t know his defencive comparison to DeRo at 2B but the SB’s are intriguing. He’s on pace again for near 50.
blackhawk24 - June 24, 2008
Yeah, the stolen bases gave me pause, too.
That’s pretty impressive. Otherwise, their numbers are somewhat similiar. I’m a little bit surprised Roberts is outslugging DeRo, but I guess that could change pretty quickly.
If anyone out there can do a quick and dirty stats-based defensive comparison, that would be interesting, too.
daver - June 24, 2008
+1
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
Comparing apples to oranges
Roberts was to be broghtin to bea leadoff man.
No knock on DeRo but those sbs would be real nice on this club.
cubbierc - June 24, 2008
Ron Santo is not going to get in the Hall
It’s become pointless to further debate the subject. All it does is serve to get Ron Santo depressed. Santo is clearly a borderline case. Fact is he never played on a great team, never made the playoffs and had a reputation for being a prick. If I had a vote then I would let Ronny into the Hall if for no other reason then there are a number of other borderline cases already in (e.g., Phil Rizzuto, Nellie Fox). But I think that ship has already sailed. Santo’s legacy is as a very good ballplayer. But not a great ballplayer. So for the sake of Ron Santo lets move on and let him enjoy what he has in life.
MDBNIU - June 24, 2008
You don't think he can get in with the 'new rules', eh?
I was thinking (OK hoping) maybe he juuuust might get there… finally.
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
Geez...thanks for popping the balloon of hope we all had MDBNIU....
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
umm...
is that rabbit trying to do what I think he’s trying to do?
CyberCyclist - June 24, 2008
yes, yes I think it is
Poor confused little bunny.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Hope he didn't buy it dinner first.
daver - June 24, 2008
bet that was exciting dinner converstion
what do you mean you don’t like cedar bedding for your cage?
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Must be where those rabbit shaped balloons come from.....
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Yeah, that's also where the expression...
...”doin’ it like rabbit-shaped balloons” comes from. Little-known fact.
daver - June 24, 2008
And, I will add that to my "little known fact" book....
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Watching this
gives new meaning to the saying “[humping] like rabbits”
gwood - June 24, 2008
Lesson of the day
I think you’re all smart enough to put this one together.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Santo has a flag flying above Wrigley.
I’m happy with that.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Everytime I see the speech he made
where he said that “This is my hall of fame”... I get a little misty. Gotta love that guy.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Word!!
gwood - June 24, 2008
Definitely.
Loved seeing that on Cubs Forever.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Any one get the book?
I haven’t had a chance yet and hadn’t heard if it was any good
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
I picked up a copy
It was a fairly interesting read, though it got quite repetitive after awhile. There are some very cool pictures, and for those of you who are lazy, there is a DVD with the book that bits and pieces of most of the interviews in the book.
mjk83 - June 24, 2008
And Ty Cobb
was a saint? It’s not the “good guys” HOF…..Cobb may have killed somebody, if we are to believe the reports.
Your case, (if you have one) isn’t accurate. On his stats alone—he’s in. Who gives a damn if he didn’t play on a great team?
You’ve just written this to provoke.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - June 24, 2008
I agree, the HOF is NOT for "just the good guys"
no matter what ESPN says. It is for great baseball players. Period.
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
re: And Ty Cobb
That pretty much sums up why MDBNIU is here.
daver - June 24, 2008
I bow to you, Great One...
Mdbniu, once again your wisdom is awe-inspiring. Selfish me, I never stopped to think about how much I was ruining Santo’s peace of mind by saying he should be in the HOF…..I’M NOT WORTHY!!!!!!! And, Sorry Ron, I will NEVER speak of the HOF again, now that I know your quality of life has been SO affected.
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Your boy Harden was mentioned
in Sullivan’s article today…take it for what its worth.
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-080623-lou-piniella-chicago-cubs,1,7301097.story
blackhawk24 - June 24, 2008
Anyone else listen to Dave Kaplan's show on 'GN last night?
FWIW, he had a Bay area sportswriter on specifically to comment on the prospect of Rich Harden coming to the Cubs. After establishing that Harden is, in fact, a very talented young pitcher, Kap kept trying to pin the guy down on whether, if he (the sportswriter) was the Cubs GM, he would make a trade for Harden.
Finally, at the end of the interview, the guy basically gave in and confessed (in so many words) that he would NOT make such a trade BECAUSE OF HARDEN’S INJURY HISTORY. He said something along the lines of “prospects are gold” and the risk of the deal would simply be too great.
daver - June 24, 2008
Hmmmm.....
seems that a lot of us already said that….....mdbniu, whadda think?
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Santo
was the best third basemen of the generation before Mike Schmidt. If Schmidt hadn’t come around then there would have been no argument about Santo belonging. Even Bill James knows he belongs, the fact that you don’t says more about you than it does about Santo.
IMHO, Santo was the best 3rd basemen who played ball from 1940 till the ‘70s.
bubbamike the one and only - June 24, 2008
Everyone of your points on Santo is wrong
The team he played on and whether or not they made the playoffs doesn’t pass the giggle test when one considers that three others from the same team have been enshrined. Santo still holds more fielding records than any of those three—and if one considers Bill James’s win shares analysis, any hint of him not being one of the VERY best players in the 60’s also disappears:
“If Bill James’ metric is to be believed, at his peak Santo was simply the top player in the National League. In 1967, he led the NL in Win Shares with 38. (Not that anyone knew it at the time.) He had four more Win Shares than Cardinals first baseman Orlando Cepeda, the unanimous NL Most Valuable Player. In Santo’s prime years, 1964 to 1967, he exceeded 30 Win Shares each season. During the 1960s, he was one of only three major leaguers to reach 30 or more Win Shares in four consecutive years. The other two were Hank Aaron and Willie Mays.” ESPN.com March—2005
Someone else mentioned Cobb-so nice guy/bad guy also has zero to do with it. In my view the NY media has been his biggest blockade-he has always NY and never hidden that fact.
cubfever7 - June 24, 2008
Just some thoughts.....
Wills actually put the steal into baseball, made it a weapon, changing the way the game was played and making it possible for Brock, Morgan, Coleman etc. to actually make their teams better. However he is NOT a HOF candidate. Santo was probably the 3rd best at his position, only Brooks and Clete Boyer were better, in my opinion. I think he deserves a shot.
The ugliness of the Tampa blow-out game thread speaks for itself. Al, you need to read it. UGLY…..gives the Brennaman’s of the world ammunition.
Hoffpauir is NOT a LF, IS a good LH bat. I worry about Ward being able to fill that role with a serious and recurring back injury. And I think he would be more valuable as part of a package to get a front line starter. I agree with Fanzone, we lose Hoff, Ward DL’s again and then what? Broussard?
Gallagher and Pie HAVE to be untouchable. They are young and greatly talented.
And, I have often said, with the team for sale, we are going to be able to spend what we have to so we can WIN the WS. The value of an already very valuable franchise would go way up with a WS win attached to it. It is really just simple business.
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
In fact it was Aparicio
who
He stole 59 which was a big thing when he did it. Willis came later and did have larger numbers.bubbamike the one and only - June 24, 2008
Pie is 'untouchable'?
Really???
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
He is only 23 and hasn't really had a chance.
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Don't know if he's untouchable
but we’d really be selling low on him right now.
Josh Timmers - June 24, 2008
We'd only be selling low
if Pie can flourish under Lou’s management style. I think Pie can (and Hill can’t). But if I’m wrong, now may indeed be the time to sell on Pie.
DGU - June 24, 2008
Pie is hurt.
I dont think he is going to be traded based on that alone.
BartlettBob - June 24, 2008
I don't know about anybody eslse
but I really hate night games after an off day… I’m bored. :-)
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
I do too......
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Ditto
No day games at ALL. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO…
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
+1
Same here. I wish KOW or her husband would do another “Let’s Get Together” fanpost. That kept me laughing for days. :)
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
Who is KOW?
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
KOW = cubstoseriesby100
daver - June 24, 2008
That fanpost never existed.
And, if it did, I categorically deny any participation in it.
daver - June 24, 2008
Area 51? What Area 51?
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
There is no spoon?
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
Take the red pill
dtpollitt - June 24, 2008
I saw that post
glanced behind the curtain and ran away. Very weird vibe from the place
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Well, now I have to look it up........
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
I believe
Al erased it to protect the innocent.
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
and if he did
its definitely for the best. i was there early and it was weird.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Ahhhhhhhh.......
now I REALLY want to read it!!!! Musta been good!
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
+1
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
You guys crack me up.
you guys crack me up. I think she did one after that and put her cell number in it, but it was deleted pretty quick.
Bump Bailey - June 24, 2008
I saw that one too
she was asking for people to text her stuff, wasn’t she about the cubs game? or somethig like that
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
She wanted updates on Big Z's injury.
Actually, she wanted attention, but I digress…
daver - June 24, 2008
yeah
still.. it was the strangest thread ever. i thought i was hallucinating. who does that?
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Well, if anyone wants to let me know
the next time she posts something, my cell is…
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
hydrogen?
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
LMAO
that is too funny
joeschmitt - June 24, 2008
Yep, I can confirm that sighting.
However, like its predecessor, all evidence has now been eliminated.
daver - June 24, 2008
Anyone hear any updated news regarding Soriano's injury?
I thought he was to be re-evaluated in the last couple days to see when he might be returning
philadelphiacub - June 24, 2008
they did an x-ray
to check and make sure the bone hadn’t shifted, the last i heard he was on schedule and would return in the 6 wks they expected. I’ll try to find that link.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
+1
That’s what I heard as well
wnielsen - June 24, 2008
TWIH
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
here's the link
the info on Fonzi is down in the middle. Here
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
thanks a bushel
philadelphiacub - June 24, 2008
Pie and Garcia
Does anyone know what actually happened to Felix? The extent of the hand problem? And I had heard that we were working Freddy Garcia out down in Mesa, any word on how that is going??
BMoney79 - June 24, 2008
Haven't seen any update on Pie, just that it is a soft tissue injury....
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Did he have a "soft tissue injury"...
during Spring Training too?
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
poor guy
i thought we’d agreed to leave that one alone.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Twisted Tissue Injury
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
Was he hurt in Spring Training?
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
NEVER MIND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! God, how could I forget THAT? OUCH!!
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Its amazing what the mind will block out
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
I think blocking that out was necessary, for sanity's sake!!!
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
he's hurt again
in mesa with a hand injury that they’ve been very non-specific about so far
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
The softest tissue of all, my friend.
daver - June 24, 2008
Aight
Thanks for the knowledge.
BMoney79 - June 24, 2008
no problem
:-)
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Felix Pie just guaranteed he won't be involved in a trade before July 31st
His market value was already in the toilet. And now he has an apparent hand injury.
MDBNIU - June 24, 2008
You don't think he did it on PURPOSE...
so you? Gasp!
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
If he did it while untwisting, it may
keep him from being apparent…..
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
That is sterously truthful
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
If you ask me, the whole idea is just....nuts
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
All this talk of testicles
probable makes Anthony Bourdain hungry.
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
I thought it was his real hand.....
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
BREAKING NEWS: Felix Pie will never hit major league pitching!!!
(Until his hand heals.)
daver - June 24, 2008
His apparent hand?
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
Yes, his apparent hand is what's been holding him back.
His other two are fine.
daver - June 24, 2008
Did one of the other two get twisted too?
crazymountain - June 24, 2008
No, they're both fine.
They are, after all, “actual” hands.
daver - June 24, 2008
I thought it was between the second & third immagined figment.
Blue W - June 24, 2008
Imagined figment
not “immagined” figment.
Blue W - June 24, 2008
OHHHHHHHHH... Let's Get Together!
Now I think I remember the post we’re talking about. The one that said everyone’s invited over for BBQ or some such crap??? Sorry, running slow today (oh OK, this WEEK – lol)
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
LOL
yep that one. it was bizarre
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Right, that one...
...which never existed. Didn’t happen. Move along, please.
daver - June 24, 2008
I posed this before in a fanpost, but no reply:
Anyone think Soriano’s injury could have lasting mental repercussions a la Dawson’s “faceball” or Sammy’s shattered helmet? Those two guys weren’t the same afterwards, most likely due to an involuntary fear reaction caused by the trauma of the event (there’s a psychological term for that). I’m a little worried because Soriano REALLY crowds the plate and starts his swing very early compared to most guys. That and his streaky nature to begin with… I would definately have him take his time on a rehab assignment before facing MLB pitching again.
Jerry Mumphrey - June 24, 2008
I would think not...
...based on how much he wants to get back so quickly. At least that’s my hope. He appears to be ‘thicker skinned’ that Sammy in the regard. But, in reference to your comment, did Dawson’s production really ‘fall off’ after that hit he took to the face? I don’t recall that.
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
I don't think he and Lou will make the "no rehab"
mistake again… and I don’t think a hand injury compares to a fast ball to the head in terms of fear. You never know, but I don’t think it’ll be a big issue.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
I hope the difference is in the hit.
Soriano was hit on the bat, his hand just happened to be between the ball and the bat. Dawson and Sammy’s issues had more to do with the ball coming at the head.
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
I think you're referring to post traumatic stress disorder.
I think, right now, he’s more frustrated than anything because he was just getting his stride (literally) back with his legs. Maybe he’ll be more likely to back away from inside pitches, but I seriously doubt this is the first time he’s been beaned before. He’ll be alright.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
He been hit 61 times in his ML career...
and considering the way he stands on the plate with his back to the pitcher….and the way he “loads” his swing with the big leg kick…I’m surprised he hasn’t gotten hit more.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
No kidding.
Truth be told, I was far more worried about the leg injury than this one.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
i hope he's been running
and gaining confidence in his legs again b/c thats more key to me
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Shouldn't be a problem.
He JUST started running hard and stealing when he was hit. That was a great sign. Plus, the silver lining to this injury was that it doesn’t affect his legs and all, and he can continue building them up during these six weeks.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
thats what i meant
that he was working on his confidence in his legs while out with the hand. :-)
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
My concern is...
he get almost all his power from his wrists….hands injuries really seem to suck the power out of players…ask Derrek Lee…on second thought don’t. Lee has always said the wrist injury was never the reason for his lack of HR last year.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
But it's the hand, not the wrist.
Wasn’t that what everyone was relieved about?
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
yeah
its the long ring finger bone between your knuckle and your wrist.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Hand...Wrist....
yeah…not the same, but think about the torque and stress put on the hand as the wrists “roll” through a swing.
just sayin’
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
I'm with ya.
Only time will tell.
He can still bunt, though.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
especially with 2 outs in the 9th
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
I had a dream once...
...that Dusty had Adam Dunn bunt in the 9th inning, down by one, with two men on. I then dreamed that Dunn tried to bunt twice, failed, decided to take a hack at it, and hit a that-son-of-a-bitch home run, aka a walk-off win.
Oh, wait, that actually happened a few weeks ago. Good job, Dusty.
Dan
dtpollitt - June 24, 2008
OH NOEZ!
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
THAT...JUST...HAPPENED
dtpollitt - June 24, 2008
I suppose he "can" theoretically...
...but we all know damn well he won’t.
daver - June 24, 2008
I've got the weirdest feeling
that his first pitch back is either gonna be extremely high and tight and make us all flinch…or a bomb. A low and outside pitch leading to a strikeout will be so anticlimactic.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
agreed
we’ll just have to wait and see
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Exactly
I believe this is just a cracked bone whereas DLee had sprained/torn ligaments/tendons in the wrist. I’ve done both and broken bones are much easier to heal and bounce back from.
N Oakley - June 24, 2008
ligaments/tissue injuries
are always tougher to ocme back from.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Maybe not for nerves, but for overall batting "rhythm" etc.
Blue W - June 24, 2008
I hope he's less afriad of the baseball...
than he is of the brick wall
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
Maybe he could start hopping when he swings.
daver - June 24, 2008
He practically does....
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Or batting 5th
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
omg
joe morgan just sort of praised the cubs on van pelt’s radio show.
course he backed straight back and said “the national league isn’t very good, but the cubs are the best in the nl”
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Maybe someone's forwarded him our complaints.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Does he do the computers?
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
Not if Sandberg does.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
He does have a point about he NL....
I just looked up the stats…and the NL is only playing .500 ball against itself.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
"Yeah, that's why we kick your butts in football almost half the time!"
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
NL isn't very strong
it was just the phrasing. The Cubs are the best in the NL, but the NL isn’t very good.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Reread SWL...
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
i did and got it
:-)
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
Right on.
Oh, and the Cubs aren’t just the best in the NL… :D
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
It was just how he tripped over himself
to keep from calling the Cubs good.
I wish van pelt had asked him about Ryno. That would’ve been great.
halfblindcubbiegirl - June 24, 2008
"You know, for my money, the Cubs are the single best team in Major League Baseball...
for me to poop on.”
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
It seems that their "Won/Loss Record"...
would indicate they are in fact the best team in Major League Baseball….if your just going by wins and losses. And we all know that wins are a bad stat to use to judge things in baseball.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Precisely.
How many victories have we had on Sunday’s with temp’s between 68 and 73, SW-blowing wind, on the road, in blue jerseys, when Zambrano has touched the bill of his cap at least three times?
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Ha ha, playing with itself
dtpollitt - June 24, 2008
That's like saying; "All of these girls are ugly,
but as far as ugly girls go, you ain’t half bad.”
Blue W - June 24, 2008
And believe you me...
most of the time…that line doesn’t work at all!
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
And when it does work,
you usually wish it hadn’t.
Blue W - June 24, 2008
"You could be a part-time model."
daver - June 24, 2008
Never heard that.
That’s good.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
"Or an air-hostess in the '60's"
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
"Or a high-class prostitute."
daver - June 24, 2008
"My place is usually tidier than this"
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Of all the girls, walking down the street, depending on the street, you would definately be in the top 3
Always nice to see a Flight of the Conchords reference. :)
carmen_fanzone - June 24, 2008
"And to seal the deal, I do my moves, I do my dance moves..."
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
(crap still can't reply): Re Sori: The ball did hit him in the face, which is pretty much where it was headed.
At any rate, rehab assignment would be a good idea. As far as the psychology I was thinking of overlearned event reaction or some such thing, not PTSD.
Jerry Mumphrey - June 24, 2008
We call that "Matt Clement Syndrome" I believe...
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
Actually, Morgan said that the Cubs had improved from 07
while the rest of the NL team had regressed. So it wasn’t quite the back handed complement that was implied here. I didn’t take it as an explanation for the Cubs W-L record, but as an opinion that the Cubs were clearly the most talented team in the NL. I’m no Joe Blow fan, but it did appear to be complementary to the Cubs.
billybuck - June 24, 2008
Must have been drunk
malicedoom - June 24, 2008
TWSS
daver - June 24, 2008
So...which potential NL playoff teams would make it toughest on the Cubs?
I say Arizona, Florida, and Houston. Mainly because they’ve always had trouble winning in those cities, and tend to get burned by young upstart players as well. Milwaukee might be worse than Houston. Basically the 5 game series has me a li’l bit worried. But it is nice to know we’ll be in it at the end already.
Jerry Mumphrey - June 24, 2008
Houston is a potential NL playoff team? Really?
daver - June 24, 2008
In the terribly weak NL...every team is a potential playoff team
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Definitely Arizona to be the toughest
simply because of their 1-2 punch of Webb and Haren. Even if they score only 2 runs against the Cubs, they are good enough to hold any offense to 1 run. We can counter with Z and Demp and/or Lily but it’s still a crapshoot.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
You mean Z and Sabathia...
oh wait…not just yet.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
that would take the argument
to toughest in the World Series, but you’re right, not just yet.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Z, Demp, Sabathia
Cerberus?
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
If I knew he'd stay healthy--i think i'd rather have Harden
We may not have to give up as much and he’s probably more signable-it’s nice that CC is lefty-but it’s possible Harden would fit in better too-not sure-I wonder if the town is big enough for Z and CC…if they got along—how cool would it be to have two behemoths as a 1-2 though?
cubfever7 - June 24, 2008
maybe the Cubs make a play for Harden
as a way to make it seem to the Indians that we can easily go a much cheaper route in terms of players we trade away…. bargaining our way down to get Sabathia at something that doesnt leave us all feeling violated.
tony412 - June 24, 2008
Johson and Schilling seemed to get along...
winning seems to do that.
santoswoodenlegs - June 24, 2008
Do you mean sybaris?
digitalbenjamin - June 24, 2008
No, I think he meant Poison
Poison for Opposing hitters.
Blue W - June 24, 2008
Dang!
I mean this:
Blue W - June 24, 2008
pwned
daver - June 24, 2008
Sad but true...
Blue W - June 24, 2008
Don't forget Philli.
And Houston? I’m much more focused on the Brewers and Cardinals in the Central than the Astros.
neverAcquiesce - June 24, 2008
Phillies are the second best team in the NL
Their hitting and pen has been solid all year long, but like the Cubs, their SP is key weakness. Also, they will be in the hunt for SP.
However, do NOT count out the Mets. Their offense has been struggling and pen has been inconsistent, but Minaya could pull of a deal for a RP such as Sherill from the O’s. I am sure their offense will come together by the second half of the season. Their team has potential and I expect them to make a late run in the division.
The Brewers…well, unless they can improve their pitiful bullpen (their best RP has been Torres), then I don’t see them keeping their hot streak. Their offense may be deadly, but their SP and bullpen will be their main downfall.
Cardinals, they could improve and become dangerous if they can get back a healthy Carpenter/Mulder, but other than that I don’t think they will be a force to be reckon with. They might continue to be good, but I don’t think they will become any better even if Pujols returns.
Geo4MVP - June 24, 2008
Oswalt
I was trying to think of some “dark horses” out there that don’t come to mind immediately when thinking of available arms. We all know the names CC, Bedard, Burnett, Harden, Wolf, are all out there, but who are we missing?
The one guy that I keep thinking about is Roy Oswalt. I, for one, see the Astros fading away quickly after the ASB. I know the first challenge to get him would be playing in the same division and he’s a righty (when we could use a lefty), however I’ve always liked Oswalt and I think he’d be a nice addition to our staff. I see him sorta having a Jimmy rebirth if surrounded by this ball club….
Just thought it’d be fun to think of some different pitchers that might become available.
cubswynn - June 24, 2008
Wagner?
What are the chances Billy Wagner gets kicked to the door?
cubswynn - June 24, 2008
Billy Wagner is a complete....
Do. Not. Want.
gary varsho - June 24, 2008
Big Brown?
sorry—couldn’t resist
cubfever7 - June 24, 2008
I'm going to
hold my jubilation on our outcry being heard by ESPN until Sunday night. If Joe Morgan retracts his statements on the baskets and Ernie or issues an apology then I will be happy.
sue369 - June 24, 2008
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