I barely know what to write any more about these defeats. The Cubs' 6-0 loss to the White Sox was about as listless an effort as I have seen in a Cubs team since 2006.
Three times in the first six innings, the Cubs had a runner on third base with less than two out. And three times, that runner stood there, unable to score. Get a couple of those guys home, and the dribbling of runs -- one here, two there -- by the White Sox might not have happened.
This team is walking around as if it's already defeated. Which, perhaps, it is. Now, I'm usually the one saying, "It's still early!" And, there is still more than half a season remaining, 90 games as of today, and 50 wins in those 90 games -- a .556 percentage, not unattainable -- would make 85. In this year's Comedy Central, that might still take it. The Brewers lost 7-0 today to a guy making his major league debut -- see, the Cubs aren't the only team that guys like that make look silly -- and the Cardinals lost to the Twins 6-2 with the newly acquired Mark DeRosa going 0-for-3 (hooray!). Thus the Cubs still remain only 3.5 games out of first place, heading into a series in Pittsburgh, a place where they have gone 11-7 since 2007.
Getting Aramis Ramirez back will not fix this team. He'll help, but he likely won't be 100% for most of, if not all of, the rest of the season and thus the Cubs need another bat. I have to believe Jim Hendry is working his cellphone overtime trying to find one, if for this reason alone: he's trying to save his job. The 2009 Cubs were, in my opinion, poorly constructed to begin with and with absolutely no depth to help out with injuries -- do you think the Cubs could have used Reed Johnson the last two days? Kosuke Fukudome can't hit lefthanders at all. Including today: 4-for-20. Jake Fox has come back to Earth -- 0-for-8 the last two days against the lefties he's supposed to crush (he did draw a walk against John Danks, and had a nice at-bat, one of the few the Cubs had all day).
About Carlos Zambrano's antics -- well, I don't think he was throwing at DeWayne Wise, do you? He had just allowed Chris Getz to steal home by throwing a ball away on the previous pitch, and knowing Carlos, he was steaming on the inside and just threw a ball kind of wherever he wanted, and it wound up on Wise's body. Incidentally, I realize plate umpire Brian Runge was just trying to get Carlos out of the way, but he put his hand on Z's back. Isn't this what Paul Schrieber had to apologize to Magglio Ordonez earlier this year for doing? The game, unfortunately, was well in the Sox' hands by then -- 3-0, on its way to being 5-0 in that inning -- and I think Z was simply letting his frustration get to him.
No one hit today, particularly with runners on base, so it would be unfair of me to single out Milton Bradley. But Bradley didn't look good striking out twice, and I repeat what I said the other day, trying to be fair here: I simply don't think the Chicago Cubs and Milton Bradley are a good fit. He told Paul Sullivan of the Tribune that he doesn't crave attention, and would rather do his job and just go home. That's great, but the Cubs don't afford him that luxury. This is a place where attention comes with the job. As a couple of people here have suggested, perhaps the pressure put on players and managers here because the team hasn't won in 100 years is too much for any individual to bear. I don't know what the answer is to that, and I'm not sure anyone does.
What I do know is that this team doesn't appear built to win the way it's currently constructed. Jim Hendry can fix that. There's still time. Go do it, Jim. At 3.5 games out, the division can still be taken.
As I noted in the preview post, I left in the 6th inning to sign, along with Kasey Ignarski, copies of "Cubs By The Numbers" at the Book Cellar in Lincoln Square. As a result, I was treated to the last three innings with Pat & Ron. They began discussing the spelling of Tigers pitcher Joel Zumaya's name. Ron couldn't quite get it. Then the name reminded Santo, somehow, of the campfire folk song "Kumbaya". If you didn't hear it, Santo started singing "Kumbaya". Pat was nearly rendered speecheless.
It's been that kind of year. Let's hope the baseball improves, or we're going to get more of that.
0 recs | 703 comments
How did the book signing go?
I hope better than the outcome of todays game…
LT - June 28, 2009
It was fun.
Sold a few books, talked to some other authors. Sorry you couldn’t make it! (Yes, I know you don’t live here.)
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Yeah
That would have been cool.
LT - June 28, 2009
Pat & Ron gave up on the team today too
…as you heard. Pretty much all day it was props for the Sox who were doing well (like Danks), and restrained dismay over the Cubs’ performances.
ChipSet - June 28, 2009
Classy guys that they are (Pat & Ron)....they give kudos to the better team....
Do the Cubbies look listless to everyone? I can’t figure out if it is just me or if they really are listless….
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
Unfortunately, they look pretty darn listless to me.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Yes, classy guys.
And dadgum it, I don’t hear the other side reciprocating when called for.
ChipSet - June 28, 2009
Hawk
When the Cubs are doing well against the Sox, all he says is nothing….just dead air. He is by far the worst and most biased announcer I’ve ever seen.
propheteer - June 28, 2009
+ one million
Grockcubs - June 28, 2009
Bias is one thing
Uecker is biased… but classy, endearing, and professional.
Hawk is biased… and… not so much.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
i'd rather miss the game
entirely than watch it with hawk calling it.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
The guy
flat out ruins the game for any fan of an opposing team. And listening to Stoney have to play second fiddle to that bumpkin makes it even worse.
OmahaCub - June 28, 2009
I wondered
don’t they have two “color” guys calling their games? I think that is the problem.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
Calling Hawk a "color" man is like calling a Nazi a nice guy.
propheteer - June 28, 2009
Fair enough
And that’s funny.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
or calling a Cardinal fan a humble person!
revtrh - June 29, 2009
Personally...
I do think Zambrano was throwing at him. We’ve seen this before (the game where Edmonds hit 2 HR’s off of him in 2004 I want to say) where he makes a mistake and then takes out his anger with a fastball to the backside of the hitter. If it helps him to cool down, then so be it. I don’t have a problem with it.
I can’t help but wonder if Fukudome’s struggles against LHP are because he never gets to face lefties. Ever. So they’re so foreign to him when he finally does. I can’t imagine he was a platoon player in Japan — not many MVP’s are. Does anyone have his splits over there?
kanderber - June 28, 2009
He faced lefties most of last year here.
Hit .276/.371/.354 against them, a higher average but less power than vs. RHP.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Also...
I’m getting so sick of Soriano’s lollygagging in the field. I posed this question in the game thread, but I’ll ask it again… when’s the last time he dove for a ball? Has he ever as a member of the Cubs? Like, a legit dive — not where he makes a shoestring catch and falls to the ground. He gives up on WAY too many balls.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
We've been told Soriano is playing injured....
…the alleged reasons for struggling at the plate and in the field.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - June 28, 2009
Then he needs to go on the DL.
Because he is not helping the team this way.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
That's what I'm thinking
This “slump” is going on a lot longer than normal for Sori
LT - June 28, 2009
Nice running catch today
I agree he probably needs a break though.
propheteer - June 28, 2009
i really think if he doesnt go to the DL he should be put down in the DL, i mean he cant do worse lower in the order, right?
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
down in the order
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
I thought you were calling for him to be
put to sleep
LT - June 28, 2009
LOL
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Well, this the has put ME to sleep for most of the year...
Zeke - June 29, 2009
One nice running catch, sure....
3 others he either judged wrong or totally gave up on.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
exactly...........
and Lou needs to make a change
Clutche - June 28, 2009
Maybe if not on the DL...
Then at least a few days off. If Reed wasn’t hurt, we could put him in there for Alfonso.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
That's the GM's decision,
isn’t it?
kcjones - June 28, 2009
he almost killed himself on the wall
against the Indians, near the same place where DeRosa ran into the phone box. Not every player has to dive.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
So you don't remember one instance...
of him diving for a ball here in two and a half years he’s been here?
I rest my case.
And I remember that play, it was a nice catch. He actually ran hard for the ball — something else that you don’t frequently see from him.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
he ran hard for the ball today.
We’ve seen it a lot this year. He’s been improving as a fielder.
You can’t blame him for not moving when Riot dropped that pop-up.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
You really think so?
I think he’s regressed as a fielder big-time this year. He’s misjudged so many routine fly balls.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
I've seen him go back to the wall
with much more ease, and I’ve seen him run for the ball flat out. I do think his knees hurt, and I think he doesn’t want to go on the DL because he feels that he can play his way out of it, but that’s utter speculation on the latter part of that.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
And again...
No one can seem to recall ONE TIME where he actually dove for a ball! How is that possible?!
kanderber - June 28, 2009
so what?
I don’t remember Sammy diving for the ball all that much. If you’re fast enough to get under it, you don’t have to dive.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Late September, 2003...
Game Sean Estes started and tossed a shutout, against Pittsburgh I wanna say… Sammy made an incredible diving catch. He used to dive when needed, that’s a pretty poor comparison.
And you’re REALLY doing a bad job of defending Sori here. “So what?” Seriously? So what if your players don’t give 100%?
Your last statement is just absurd. We’ve seen Soriano give up on balls countless times.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
I remember that play
Sosa was like a dolphin on the DOWNHILL side of the curve when he caught the ball. It was an absolute perfect play.
I’m not sure I could name another one though.
Worf - June 28, 2009
I'm not sure why Sammy's name was even brought up...
he is irrelevant to a discussion regarding the effort of Soriano. But I don’t ever remember anyone questioning Sammy’s effort. Ever.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
an example of another player
who didn’t dive much.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Again, so what?
I’m not saying that Soriano is the only player in baseball who doesn’t give 100%. You don’t have to try and think of other players (though again, Sammy was a terrible example) who can dog it from time to time.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
why is Sammy a bad example?
you just got through saying that no one questioned Sammy’s effort. But you would — because he rarely dove for the ball, right? And that’s an indication that he didnt’ give 100%, right?
Cripes.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
You're impossible.
It’s not just about diving for balls. It’s about lollygagging out there. The diving for balls was just an example of Soriano’s poor effort — considering he NEVER does it.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
you haven't made
a compelling case for him being lazy. But then, no one ever really has.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I'll agree he's not lazy...
But just lacks outfield instincts. I don’t doubt he’s trying.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
this
I agree with.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
This is EXACTLY correct
heine41 - June 28, 2009
I agree with this. And so did the Sox radio announcers.
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
I don't think
a player has to dive to prove that he’s giving 100%. Shrug.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
When the alternative...
is to pull up and let it bounce in front of you, yes, it’s a matter of giving 100%.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
I don't think
he’s doing that. He may be getting a late jump, taking a bad route. Or, you know. The ball is dropping in front of him, because that’s what base hits do when they’re not going over your head.
It’s not like this is easy. if it were easy, everyone would do it.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Good grief.
The dude hasn’t dove for a ball in 2.5 years and you’re gonna sit here and tell me you think he’s giving 100% on every play? Seriously, man?
kanderber - June 28, 2009
yep.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
LOL.
Okay then. Thank you for at least confirming your incredibly absurd logic. I suppose this discussion is more or less over then.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
it was over
before you started. You’ve never been able to prove that Soriano is lazy, and you won’t be able to — because, you know. He’s not.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Soriano isn't lazy
he’s just a really poor outfielder. You gotta live with it though because his bat seems to be heating up a slight bit.
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
he's a perfectly fine outfielder
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
he's a below average fielder.
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
I disagree.
well, this year, so far, fine. But as a ball player, he’s a fine left-fielder.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Cmon Drew
seriously you can not think that Soriano is a FINE left fielder..he is easily one of the worst in the game..end of story no one should ever argue with that..and if someone does then they just have a man crush on that guy..cuz he is terrible in the field
cubbiepride - June 28, 2009
I continue
to disagree. Someone put the stats up in another post. He was second only to Braun.
It’s not like Left field is where you put your best defensive players.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
What the hell kind of stat...
Has Ryan Braun as the best defensive left fielder? And what kind of idiot actually puts stock into that stat?!
Seriously, do you watch the games? Anyone will tell you that Ryan Braun is a terrible LF.
kanderber - June 29, 2009
you keep asking that question
and I keep answering it.
Who said I was ranking defensive left-fielders?
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Well...
Considering that’s what the entire discussion has been about…
Alfonso Soriano isn’t second in anything this year. Not offense and certainly not defense.
kanderber - June 29, 2009
no one is arguing
that he’s playing well this year, although he’s shown flashes.
I’ve been talking about his history as a left fielder. He has been a good one.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
A good one, yes.
2nd best in baseball? Absolutely not.
kanderber - June 29, 2009
I never said he was 2nd best in baseball.
I never said he was 1st best in baseball.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Ummmm, yes, you did. Look up!
“I continue to disagree. Someone put the stats up in another post. He was second only to Braun.”
kanderber - June 29, 2009
are you saying Braun is the best LF in baseball?
because I did not say that.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Are you mentally retarded?
I don’t mean that as an insult, it’s an honest question. What I quoted was your words a handful of posts above this.
Christ, man.
kanderber - June 29, 2009
find where it says
“best in baseball” above. It doesn’t.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
you keep asking that question
and I keep answering it.
Who said I was ranking defensive left-fielders?
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
I think he's excellent
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
Gee, what a surprise.
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
well
he’s getting good jumps, has great speed, catches the ball when he gets to it, has a strong accurate arm. What more do you want?
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
Do you think he's dreamy?
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
inappropriate
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
inappropriately
fixed that for ya.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
you could say that Shangai
said that inappropriately, absolutely.
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
no, you think he’s dreamy in an inappropriate fashion.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Why is that?
Would groovy have been a better term?
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
Cool - we agree on something
I find Braun inappropriate, too.
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
thanks for the chuckle
Braun is excellent at fielding, so you make some weird personal attack on me. heh
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
No, I made fun of your choice of words, not you
I don’t even know you.
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
♫You know, you acting like you don’t know
I tear the club up fo’ sho’
This flow is gon’ bring mo dough
And you know but you acting like you don’t know
♫
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
♪♫♪♫
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
c'mon now
the word “excellent.” You don’t have to actually meet me to make personal attacks, as well you know.
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
Yes, you're correct.
My comment about knowing you wasn’t substantive evidence.
However, I meant nothing personal by the original comment. I was merely being silly.
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
he loves gazing into
his
biglargeenormousAMAZINGLY HUGE GOOGLY EYES!drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Well
if we’re making fun of people, how about Marmol?
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
he's got big ears
and he can’t throw his fastball over the plate.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Sure.
Those ears make him look like a car with the doors open.
How’s that?
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
and not just any car
a car with REALLY BIG DOORS. Maybe that’s the problem — the wind is blowing in at Wrigley when he pitches, and it’s pushing him over on the mound.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
I think you're on to something there
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
someone give Larry Rothschild
a crate of duct-tape!
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
The circular logic here...
Is astounding.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
He's pretty bad Drew...
Even Brenly has had enough of watching him out there.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
You're wasting your time
He’s convinced Sori is the best LF in the NL
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I can see where he's coming from...
Because when Sori is on offensively, I think people can stomach the defense.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Sure, the hot streaks are amazing
But there isn’t much consistency.
He’s an above average offensive player when he’s right, but he’s not the best LF.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
agree
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
Statistics....
would indicate that he’s actually a pretty good LF…and ranks pretty well with a number of metrics.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
He didn't have
a particularly great day, although he made a good running catch today.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
that is an absurd statement
DC Cubbie - June 28, 2009
Try watching a game sometime...
the case will present itself.
What about the leadoff hit into the gap that the freaking CF-er had to chase down, spin around, and fire into second? How on earth was that not a double?
kanderber - June 28, 2009
I watch and/or listen to
almost every game that’s played, save the ones on the west coast.
Have you stopped reading the bits where we talk about how he’s playing with a hurt knee?
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Again with the excuses...
kanderber - June 28, 2009
right.
because playing the exceedingly athletic game of baseball is easy.
Why aren’t you doing it, again?
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Who's talking it being easy?
The dude makes almost 20 million dollars. He could freaking give 100% on a daily basis. But he doesn’t.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
except
for the part where he does. Because, you know. Proof. You ain’t got none.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
And, you know...
Neither do you.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
sure.
but I’m not the one questioning him. You are. Burden of proof. You know. On the accuser. But you got none.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
This isn't a freaking court of law...
I don’t have to “prove” anything. What’s wrong with you?
kanderber - June 28, 2009
If you come claiming one thing
I expect you to prove it. If you don’t…..bro….it kinda discredits anything you say
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Ummm, that goes both ways... bro...
I can’t prove that he doesn’t give 100%, as I claim, just as you can’t prove that he does, as you claim.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
you're the one
making the claim, “bro”.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
this is asinine....its like me calling you gay
can I prove it? No. But I guess you can’t really prove to me otherwise….so I guess you are gay?
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Is that supposed to be insulting?
Arbusto - June 28, 2009
no
it’s supposed to be an example of being unable to prove a negative.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
not at all, just an example of poor logic
But apparently, I’m a 12 year old, so what do I know
heine41 - June 29, 2009
nothing
again, you’re the one who is making the accusation, but you’ve got nothing to back it up. So I adeptly and adroitly parry your accusations with “no, he doesn’t” and don’t need anything else.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I've got my eyes to back it up...
Try stepping away from your computer for ONE GAME… just actually (crazy concept coming) WATCH THE GAME once rather than reporting to the blog what happens after every pitch. Maybe then you will see what is so obvious.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
again
I watch games all the time. There are these things called laptops, you know.
What’s obvious is that you’ve got an anti-Soriano bias. I won’t speculate as to why. I don’t particularly care. You’re wrong. You have no proof. You’re welcome to your opinion, but it carries no weight.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
See that's the thing...
I don’t have anti-Soriano bias at all. I’m a fan of his. The only Cub I dislike is Miles. You, on the other hand seem to have the blinders on. But that goes for every Cubs player. You constantly defend every single player on this roster. Which, of course, diminishes what small amount of credibility you had to begin with.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
not at all
but you consistently rag on Soriano, and you’ve got no reason to do so. So, whatever. You’re the one making the accusation. Back it up, or drop it.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
No reason to do so?
.230 BA, low 700 OPS, 18M salary. Should I keep going?
kanderber - June 28, 2009
none of which
is evidence of anything other than an extended slump, and certainly no evidence of being lazy.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Try and keep up...
That was in response to your “you’ve got no reason to rag on Soriano” statement.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
it's all built
on your house of cards that he’s lazy.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
very well said
Clutche - June 28, 2009
He really does have knee trouble
And should be on the DL
I don’t question Sori’s desire. I do question his instincts as an outfielder.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Drew - forget Kanderber for a second and reply to Shanghai (or me) here
because as Soriano’s staunchest defender on BCB, I’d love to know your thoughts on what Shanghai says.
If Soriano is hurt as you claim, then don’t you think he should go on the DL? If no, then why not? Can you honestly tell me that you’re pleased with Soriano’s entire body of work this season? If not, then what would you suggest to improve it?
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
I’ve said several times in the past few weeks that I’d like to see him sit. But I wouldn’t want Hoff or Fox out there for an extended amount of time. When RJ comes back, if Sori need to sit for a week, then by all means, sit him. I think he needs the rest.
I wouldn’t mind if he picked up a lighter bat, either.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
That's a much better and more concise argument...
… than going back and forth with several people contentiously.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
you are arguing someone needs to dive for a ball in order to display hustle or effort
its just not his game.
heine41 - June 28, 2009
The other thing you have to remember
is that he started out as an infielder not an outfielder. If you don’t know what you are doing on a dive you could be on the DL in a hurry
LT - June 28, 2009
That's a terrible argument...
He’s 30 something years old and has been playing baseball since he was a little kid. He knows how to dive.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
Yes sir
Mr. Expert…..
LT - June 28, 2009
Okay?
I’m just saying, what you said it’s just flat out silly. He doesn’t know how to properly dive? Come on.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
why is DIVING so important to you?
Soriano sucks cause he doesn’t make the highlight reels?
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Am I talking to a 12 year old?
Why is diving important? Do you honestly not know the answer to that?
kanderber - June 28, 2009
I understand the importance of diving
But it is no secret it isn’t a part of fonzi’s game. I can’t blame him for knowing that and taking a ball on the hop instead of misplaying it and it leading to a triple
heine41 - June 28, 2009
I've got to disagree with you on this
My favorite player of all time rarely dove, yet consistently led the league in total chances at his position. He prided himself on being in position to make a play without having to dive.
He also won nine gold gloves and is the reason why my softball jersey has “23” on the back of it.
Diving isn’t the be-all end-all way to judge a fielder.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Ryno would dive for balls...
both up the middle and in the hole. He was my favorite player as well, and is the reason I’m a Cubs fan.
I know diving isn’t the end all be all. But I think it’s pretty representative of a player’s effort when he hasn’t dove for a ball in over two years. Wouldn’t you agree?
kanderber - June 28, 2009
Not necessarily
I’m sure you’ve played some kind of ball at some level. I never was great, but I can tell you this — the times that I have dove for a ball, it just happened. It wasn’t a concious decision; I was going for the ball and that’s what my body ended up doing to get there.
Sori’s instincts are bad . . . and I think the instincts are what makes a player dive. You may disagree; what do you think from your own experience?
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I haven't played...
organized baseball since little league, so I really can’t add much from personal experience.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
Well, again - I'm not that good
But that’s been my own experience on the softball diamond.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
yep
and have you ever had guys who have played infield most of their life play some outfield in a blowout game? They have a hard time getting a read on the ball coming to them. It takes a lot of instincts and time playing out there. Now Sori is a pro athlete, but I don’t think he looks comfortable out there. Luckily he has a cannon for an arm.
LT - June 28, 2009
Agreed. Forget diving for a second and think about sliding.
Actually don’t think about sliding because if you do, you’re going to mess yourself up but good. Whether you go in feet first or head first, it’s the same thing. You just do it.
[cue Maverick quote]
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
we train our kids on the LL team
to slide when we yell SLIDE! Without fail. I got Max to slide into a puddle doing that the other day. Like, at the park, not during a practice. He was running and playing, and just to test him, I yelled SLIDE! and there it was.
Too bad we can’t train them to get a double when we yell HIT! :P
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
if his instincts are bad
wouldn’t that mean he would have to dive for more balls?
Where Triples Go to Die - June 29, 2009
So he can make an out?
Instead of a single. Getting to the ball…either by getting a good jump, pure speed, climbing a wall, or diving for a ball is important to ANY outfielder.
Fonzie doesn’t appear to have (m)any of those skills.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
My 0.02
Ryne Sandberg didn’t dive that much, but that’s because he was terrific at being in the right position to start with. Now I’m not saying that Sori is the LF equivalent of Ryno; however diving for a ball isn’t necessarily an accurate way to measure range – or desire.
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Ignore this
I didn’t see Shanghai’s post above mine.
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
I was teasing
And people shouldn’t ignore it . .. I don’t have an exclusivity patent on that point! Your paragraph is no less valid.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Is there an echo in here? ;-)
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
An echo?
XD
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
I've played basketball my whole life...
But I’m 5’11" and I suck at dunking. Just because he’s played his whole life doesn’t mean one aspect of his game can’t be lacking.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
so you are equating
your physical inability to dunk a basketball to soriano’s lack of desire to dive for a baseball? that doesn’t seem to make sense. You CAN NOT dunk, Soriano WILL NOT dive. There is a major, major difference between those two
murphymj - June 28, 2009
Maybe he lacks...
The physical ability and coordination to dive for balls in the outfield. Coming up as an infielder, he probably didn’t do much full sprinting in on balls, having the opportunity to dive.
He’s in his 30’s now, his legs aren’t what they used to, why should he try to pick up a new skill with the risk of injury? If the rim was lowered a foot for me, I’d be able to dunk. However, I’d still be bad at it and risk injury because it is not in my skill set.
I know the analogy is a stretch, but you get my point.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Soriano is 30..
And how old was Edmonds last year? It’s just nice to see the extra effort every once in awhile..thats all.
BadDecisions - June 29, 2009
Soriano is 33, not 30.
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
Some guys...
…just don’t look like they are going full blast when they indeed are in their mind. I realize Soriano is not Mr. Hustle, but I also don’t think he intentionally loafs around either. He is what he is, and the Cubs should have known that when he was signed.
MPH73 - June 29, 2009
This is true...
How many times to you see players roll over there wrists awkwardly. A broken wrist by Soriano and bye-bye bat speed.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
I don't think he gave 100% yesterday
when he lead off the game with a single in the gap… Which should have been a double but was still standing at first when the ball finally got thrown back to the infield. Bob and Len called him out on that.
Fishbone2 - June 29, 2009
So you dive and miss the ball.....
and its a triple. If you can’t make it, you can’t make it
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Obviously he's not fast enough then...
By the amount of balls dropping in front of him lately. And comparing him to Sammy, yeah… not helping your case much.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
only because
people have a biased view of Sammy Sosa. I was using him as an example.
If, as has been noted, his knees hurt, then he’s probably struggling to get under the ball. One fly ball, he definitely misplayed today.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I seem to recall Lou saying...
That Soriano may have broken up some scar tissue in his knee or something rounding 1st a few weeks ago, and the pain he had went away. Obviously something is still lingering.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
1st off
do you know how hard it is to dive while hopping for the ball…..???
cozmotaylor123 - June 28, 2009
now that was funny...
he doesn’t dive cause he doesn’t want to hurt himself, but I believe earlier this year, in maybe Milwaukee, I think, he did make like a half dive… and caught the ball. First time I ever saw him leave his feet. But if the Cubs didn’t have Theriot (or Blanco) running out there on every fly ball getting in his way he may be a better fielder, he never calls them off though, probably because the coaches told soriano to yield to the other players whenever possible… so he just lets the ball drop.
dtc0405 - June 28, 2009
What game were you watching?
Clutche - June 28, 2009
same game everyone else was
except for you and Kanderber. Sori plays hard, and he tries hard. Everyone understands that he’s slumping right now. You can’t sit out a slump on the bench.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Soriano
Like you say Drew, isn’t the best but the pissing and moaning is bewildering.
Soriano’s UZR in LF:
’06: 8.1
’07: 1.2
’08: 2.5
UZR isn’t the end all be all of defense stats but it’s a good indication. Soriano isn’t worth all the pissing and moaning, there are other things wrong with this club that are far far more important.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
Interesting thing about that...
… compare that to other players in the same position and their UZR… all below have at least 15 games in LF:
2008 UZR: Reed Johnson 4.5, Sori 2.5, DeRo 0.2
2007 UZR: Cliff Floyd 4.6, Matt Murton 1.2, Sori 1.2
Not taking in to account this doesn’t really measure dude’s arm / ability to turn double plays / throw runners out (and other general things we appreciate Dome for), he really isn’t that bad.
Diving / flailing / falling down doesn’t necessarily signify good catch. I see comments here all the time celebrating circus catches and think to myself “well, sure… that looked cool, but if he’d played it a step quicker he’d never have had to leave his feet and risk losing the ball on impact with the ground / wall.”
AndrewJStone - June 28, 2009
Interesting
The only exception I’ll hold is DeRosa in ‘08 other than that I’d say Soriano’s offense makes up for the lack of defense next to those other names. Soriano has had a few Outfield Assists that I recall, no?
Kinda like what Moneyball talked about with Jeremy Giambi.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
he's had so many
that runners don’t try any more.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Bradley not being a good fit...
…is definitely spot on. This is the wrong place for him to be if he “just wants to do his job and go home.” This is Chicago, and the Chicago Cubs we’re talking about here. This team gets more media attention than every other team besides the Mets and Yankees.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
he is not lazy
just sucks at fielding, and so far this year hitting
DC Cubbie - June 28, 2009
sorry meant for below, too much sun and beer today
DC Cubbie - June 28, 2009
Oh no..... it's a ball hit to Soriano
Today had to be the worst performance I have seen by a left fielder in a long long time. (since Dave Kingman ) he was lazy uninspired and an embarrassment to this team. I have stood up for him for to long, either he needs to get it together , or get the %&% outta town
LouPrules - June 28, 2009
See above...
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - June 28, 2009
The worst part is...
He actually appears to be regressing in the field.
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
Is that possible?
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Evidently
n/t
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
Where exactly can he go?
With his contract, age, indifference in the field, and continued slump who would take him? Teams are not in the business of eating contracts, especially mammoth ones like his. Same with Bradley and Fukudome. Hendry has literally painted himself into a corner.
propheteer - June 28, 2009
I don't think it's indifference...
In the field. I think he just legitimately takes horrible routes and gets bad jumps. On the one that dropped in today, he took about two steps back then had to run in on it and have it fall. I won’t knock his effort, he just doesn’t have an outfielder’s instincts.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
That's what the Sox radio announcers were saying...they also said something like
it’s always a “bonus” when Sori can make a catch in the OF.
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
that's
unfair to the extreme. Sori is a competent fielder.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Yes,
I think Zambrano threw at Wise. He was embarrassed, and I felt like he thought the Sox showed him up on that suicide/steal.
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
If that's the case
Then he’s an even bigger idiot than I thought.
Only in Z’s mind can a team show you up by trying to win
Worf - June 28, 2009
If he did...
I would think it more an emotional reaction from an emotional player. But lord knows he’s done dumber.
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
I disagree....
Plus, Geo missed the squeeze play. Z threw it outside (maybe a tad too much), like he’s supposed to and Geo was still behind the plate. Not his fault and the next pitch just looked too much inside on Wise, who does crowd the plate.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
July 2nd-12th is HUGE.
A 4 game set with the Brewers, a 4 game set with the Cardinals during that time. All at Wrigley. Those games are what the season comes down to, IMO. We win those series, we definitely are right in it. However, the way we are playing now, I don’t have too much faith in us winning either one of those series.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
CAPTION
“Wow, Geo. That’s a HUGE zit on your forehead!”
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Perhaps Bradley wouldn't be drawing so much "attention"
if he had been simply “serviceable” offensively year to date and not on an RBI pace trailing Cincy PITCHER Micah Owings. There are plenty of games left but a team that can’t go more than two games in a row with a strong offensive performance is probably due for a .500 year in 2009.
BeltwayCubsFan - June 28, 2009
I wouldn't have thought it earlier.....
but this Pirates series Is HUGE. Andrew McCutcheon appears to be the real deal.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
Yep.
Not like it’s some big achievement to do this, but they just took 2 of 3 from the Royals.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
and only 1.5 games behind us...
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
They're also 21-14 at PNC this year.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
[Bradley] told Paul Sullivan of the Tribune that he doesn’t crave attention, and would rather do his job and just go home. That’s great, but the Cubs don’t afford him that luxury. This is a place where attention comes with the job.
I’m pretty sure Milton Bradley understands that being a ball player comes with attention. He just doesn’t want any EXTRA attention. LIke, you know. Articles asking if he should be booed before his first at bat at Wrigley.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Tough
The extra attention comes with the territory of playing in the 3rd largest market in the country, for a team that hasn’t won it all in 100 years.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
no one wrote an article
asking if Aaron Miles or Kevin Gregg, or Fukudome would be booed before their first at bat at Wrigley.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
they
aren’t black
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Here we go again.
It’s the big, bad, and apparently racist media.
How is it that Michael Jordan, an admitted philanderer, is the most beloved figure in Chicago sports?
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Not to mention Ernie Banks...
…Billy Williams, Andre Dawson or for that matter Derrek Lee. Jacque Jones and laTroy Hawkins got the same treatment Todd Hundley did, and for the same reason: lack of production.
ChipSet - June 28, 2009
Just so I'm clear
it appears as though you’re justifying racial slurs being thrown out because of lack of production. Please, please tell me it’’s a misunderstanding.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
It's a misunderstanding --
Racial slurs are never appropriate. The context of the question, though, was why was about players being “booed”. It was asked of MB and not of other (non-black) players. But the answer has everything to do with his track record.
My point is that the fans and media have a long history of embracing successful players of any color, and disdaining underperforming players of any color.
ChipSet - June 29, 2009
Gregg has been mercilessly booed...
Howry was booed and even almost attacked by a fan running onto the field. His race has nothing to do with this.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
This really wasn't a helpful comment.
It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with the size of his contract and the size of his reputation.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
It's well known
Wrigley can be racist. Ask Hawkins and JJ. The media may not but the element is still there.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
I take issue with such...
I’m sure you don’t mean the stadium… and surely you don’t mean every person that attends Cub home games is racist.
Sure there will be ignorant people, but I would hope that such behavior would be quashed posthaste
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
Absolutely not
I’v’e been to games where Sox fans (surprise!) have yelled some really obnoxious things at the ushers in Wrigley.
The inuendo I was suggesting was that of the fans, not be confused with the actual field, though I don’t know how Wrigley Field could be considered racist but whatever.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
What does that have to do with the insinuation?
The behavior to JJ and Hawkins – and Baker was reprehensible, but that’s got nothing to do with the media.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Dusty too?
I know people were letting him have it in 06 but honestly I thought it was because the team was sucking, he wouldn’t play rookies, he said walks clog the bases, etc..
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
He got racist mail, yeah.
Sickening.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Totally uncalled for
I had a lot of problems with Baker and admittedly I need to let go of a lot of frustrations during his time as manager, but I would never do something like that.
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
It gets worse
Reportedly, some people wrote that they hoped his cancer came back. Stuff like that makes me worry about humanity.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
You all have my permission to shoot me
if I ever get that carried away in here.
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Overboard.
There may be a lot you may not like about a person, but hoping that they relapse with cancer is just wrong.
Vermont Cubs Fan - June 28, 2009
Reading is a skill
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
So is diplomacy
Which you have consistently shown to be lacking in.
Beyond your snarkiness, the min-thread was a discussion about the media’s treatment of Bradley.
Yes, reading is indeed a skill.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
no no
I merely contributing to the thought of racism. Wasn’t talking about Bradley I was talking about racism and how it is prevalent, that’s it.
I’m glad you agree reading is a skill though.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
It is more prevalent than I'd like, yes.
I don’t argue that one bit.
My point, however poorly worded it may have been ,was tomas21’s claim seemed dubious at best.
Kudos to you for the tone of your reply – seriously.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I worked in retail
for years man before I do what I do now, it’s not always easy. Haha.
I see what you mean now. Like I said I was just pointing out the prevalance of the racism. I’m pretty indifferent to Bradley altogether.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
I still think he'll hit, but I'd like to see a little less of him playing the victim
And I did mean it about the kudos….I do sometimes overreact to statements like that, which I may have this time. You could have easily taken this down a bad road. I’ll keep that in mind.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
his babip
is about .50 off. When he comes out of it he’s gonna rake, it’s only a matter of time though.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
Yes, it is still very prevalent.
Just look at Vermont, for instance. Only around 2% of the people here are from minority groups. We’re one of the whitest states in the US.
Vermont Cubs Fan - June 28, 2009
And the element
is in NY, LA, Hou, Cinn, StL, etc. No one would disagree with that. However, when it is brought up, it suggests that the element of racism is exceptional in Chicago. I would take exception to that.
The city of Chicago has always respected players who play hard, black, white or brown. It seems unfair to suggest there is rampant racism is to denigrate millions of decent people who couldn’t give a damn about race based upon the absurdities of a minuscule number of jerks.
tharr - June 28, 2009
Right
I wasn’t referring to the media so much as the way under-performing Cubs that happen to be black get demonized WAY more than white guys. Everyone in the stands isn’t racist, everyone on this board (hopefully noone) isn’t racist, but the collective mentality seems to have some racist elements to it.
I am not saying that there haven’t been very unpopular white players (Hundley comes to mind). But nobody gets vilified like a poorly performing black player, and nobody gets deified like an over-performing white guy.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
I think Scottie Pippen is WAY overrated
Almost deified when he was playing.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
2 things
1. Nobody said anything was absolutes, you are using the exception to try to prove the generalization wrong
2. Scottie Pippen is widely regarded as one of the top 50 players ever. Just because YOU think he’s over-rated does not make it so.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Badger badger badger
Scottie Pippen was the 2nd best player in the NBA when he played.
Worf - June 28, 2009
snake!
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Perhaps you can explain
why only white pitchers get vilified. This year it’s been Heilman and Gregg and Cotts. Last year it was Howry, Marquis and Eyre. How about Farnsworth? So maybe position players who are black and pitchers who are white have been categorized by racists. Is that possible? Of course it isn’t.
Bradley isn’t getting jumped on because he’s black. His performance and actions have made him a target. He put the bullseye on his back. And he can remove it.
tharr - June 28, 2009
"He put the bullseye on his back"
True, to a certain extent. Well put.
cubsnlinux - June 29, 2009
Marmol hasn't been villified?
I’m not agreeing that it’s racism at all, but Marmol has gotten some crap this year.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
And why has Marmol gotten crap this year?
His performance.
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
Is that allowed?
/sarcasm
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
Again, tough
Crap happens. Life’s unfair. If that’s the sole reason that he’s having a bad year, he would have been useless, anyway.
You think the fans at Miller Park ask him how things are going? Do they greet him with a “hi, there” in St. Louis?
Professional athletes need to have thicker skins than that. They perform on the public stage.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I don't think it's the sole reason he's having a bad year.
I think it’s the reason he’s been the focus of this blog so much, tho. And I think he hasn’t been given a fair shake, and I don’t think that “tough” is fair, either.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Really? That article is why he's talked about on this blog?
Not the outbursts or the poor offensive output?
Hmm.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I think
the inordinate media attention is a big part of it, yes.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Two things
You insinuated it was that one article . . . I don’t think that’s what you meant, so I won’t harp on that.
However — this is a BLOG. People come here to discuss the Cubs. Of course they’re going to talk about what’s in the MSM.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I understand that
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Then why crusade against it?
It’s a losing battle.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
because
it’s the right thing to do. I don’t pick my battles based on how likely I am to win.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Well, if you think so, carry on
But I think you’re giving it far too much importance…and your case gets weakened when you ignore contradictory evidence.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I think his past had a lot to do with it...
And I think the whole DeRosa misconception played a part as well.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
certainly
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I don't think Miles, Gregg nor Dome have the somewhat checkered past that Bradley does as well.
At this point in his career, Bradley has to expect stuff like that, and based on what I’ve read in the last few days, I think he does. Of course, he’d rather not have to see/hear all that stuff all the time, but it’s his bed – he’s made it and he has to lie in it. I think he understands that.
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
I think the racist angle is being incorrectly mushed in with booing
Two separate conversations:
1) Several african-american players have reported hostile environments in Chicago whether it is via hate mail, uttered slurs, etc. Enough players have mentioned it for us to discount there is some validity there.
2) This is different than the booing. Cub fans boo mercilessly with little regard to color and are pretty good gauges on when prolonged bad performance warrants booing. Farnsworth, Howry and Cotts got it just as bad as Bradley, Patterson, etc.
BeltwayCubsFan - June 29, 2009
Soriano cont....
I’ve heard no word that he is injured…. If so I take back my words…… but he was just awful playin in the wind today, and totally looked unispired… If that is the best he can do injured, he needs to sit out till he can hustle again
LouPrules - June 28, 2009
I've been looking thru all three Chicago papers
..can’t find anything. But, Len and Bren have mentioned this — that Soriano has been playing hurt most of the season, but he (Soriano) says it’s not enough to disable him or keep him on the bench. (I believe they’ve discussed leg/knee problems)
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - June 28, 2009
I've heard knee from Len and Bob.
propheteer - June 28, 2009
Just read your whole post, Al.
The Bradley stuff is getting a bit old. You had a pretty controversial (for lack of a better word) post about him the other day, and your feelings are more than well documented here. Of all people to write a paragraph about today, you choose him? Why not Theriot and his 0-4 day with 2 K’s and the dropped pop up? Why not Soriano and his brutal defense along with a ball hit into the gap which he didn’t wind up on 2B?
Besides, Bradley could’ve easily been 0-2 with 2 BB’s. That called third strike was certainly debatable.
kanderber - June 28, 2009
On Theriot
Don’t forget the horrible attempt to tag out Wise, who would have been out by 3 feet had Riot not chased him with the ball, instead of waiting for him to slide into the glove.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I guess since it's his blog
he can write about whatever he wants.
sue369 - June 28, 2009
Brilliant insight...
Thank you so much for that.
kanderber - June 29, 2009
For the love of Mike Myers
Can we please stop with the “He touched him! He touched him! Cooties!” when it comes to umps and players.
The White Sox were coming out of their dugout and the Cubs were coming out of theirs. The umps have every right to keep the players from getting into it.
How about this? If a player, manager, general manager, broadcaster or owner calls attention to a bump, touch, brush, or excessive heavy breathing, then it’s fair game. Otherwise, let’s just assume the men on the field know what is over the line and what isn’t.
Worf - June 28, 2009
Z's quote
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/recap;_ylt=AiiM18NQapU7fvt.Rkm1ZBw5nYcB?gid=290628104
Worf - June 28, 2009
Hyper?
Yes, and then Zambrano taunted Wise. I don’t believe the Cubs WGN broadcast showed that nor mentioned it.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
Did that poster boy for cousin love, Hawk Harrelson, tell you that?
Or did you come with that all by yourself?
Worf - June 28, 2009
Watch it yourself...
… watch it yourself, Zambrano was waving him over.
Other than that I’ll ignore your taunts and insults.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
Oooh... ignoring me
that NEVER works. Ask around. I’m unignorable. I’ve just not bothered with you before.
But I’m in the mood for White Sox meat.
Worf - June 28, 2009
YES!
chilango2 - June 28, 2009
I'm Drewishdrewid
and I approve of this message.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Cubbie bear meat...
Detroit feasted on.
Sox feasted on too this weekend.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
and of course
there’s the whole part where Denks OBVIOUSLY threw at Freel.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
And of course...
… there’s the whole part where Zambrano OBVIOUSLY threw at Podsednik and Wise. Sox got the ultimate revenge though as Zambrano left the game with a loss.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
not at all
Lou doesn’t play the retribution game.
Crazy Ozzie, on the other hand…
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Right...
… and Lou controls what Zambrano does with the ball. Sure.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
What do you want him to do?
(Note: I am waving my arms after I hit post)
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
dood
today, Zambrano didn’t control what Zambrano did with the ball. It wasn’t intentional. Remove the chip from thy… wait, the skin has grown over it. SURGICALLY remove the chip from thy…
I command the demons that have cursed this chip on this shoulder to GET OUT in the name of OBJECTIVITY!
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Drew, please don't take offense, but when it comes to objectivity about the Cubs
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Noted Cubs Hater Todd Hollandsworth...
… says that he believe Zambrano hit Wise on purpose.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
Whoop de do
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
That's as good as it gets
Clutche - June 29, 2009
It's my observation and ...
… from what I heard Bob Brenly seems to agree with me. Or at least I didn’t hear Brenly say it was all an innocent accident.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
I expect
Bob Brenley has not made a comment about the JFK assassination. Conspiracy!
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Ok...
… it’s a wild JFK Assassination-like conspiracy to think that Zambrano threw at Pods and Wise. Right. If you believe that, fine, go on in that.
I just happen to believe that Zambrano did throw at those two today (and that Danks rightfully stepped up for his team and threw at Freel.) You’ll not be convinced by that but you’re quite confident though that Danks did it on the other hand and with just as much evidence.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
that's good.
because that’s EXACTLY what I believe. Z had no control. He was wild. He hit Wise by accident. Denks was ordered to, because that’s exactly the guy Ozzie Guillen is.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
It is overwhelmingly likely
you’re wrong, bro.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
right
because while Carlos didn’t have enough control to keep Ramirez from hitting a home run, but he had enough control to hit Pods and Wise.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
I have no desire
to embark on a urinary olympiad here, but the facts seem to be these.
You may very well be right.
However, Z is a head case. He’s been known to hit people who hit him well. He gets made when the other team beats him, and he has been known to plunk ppl in retaliation.
Z did not execute on the squeeze. The run scored, and it is at least possible… if not likely that Z took out his frustrations on Denks.
A rational person must admit it is possible Z did it on purpose.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
actually
Soto didn’t execute on the squeeze.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
No...
… I don’t think Danks was “ordered to because that’s exactly the guy Ozzie Guillen is.” I think Danks stepped up and did exactly what was needed w/o an order.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
because Guillen
has made it clear what is and isn’t acceptable.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Noted Cub haters...
Todd Hollandsworth, Les Grobstein & Brian Hanley all agree that Zambrano threw at Pods & Wise.
DrCrawdad - June 29, 2009
all the more reason
to think he didn’t.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Neither more nor less
Doc’s argument is specious and ill-formed (shocker), plus misplaced when he replied to me above when I was essentially agreeing with him (another shocker).
Hollandsworth works for the Cubs.
Anyway, there actually are people who are able to objectively discuss the merits of an event/comment, etc. despite their personal feelings regarding the people involved.
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
Hollandsworth works for Comcast Sports Net, not the Cubs.
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
Yeah, I realized that after I hit post
But the club does have some influence, I would think.
Point was, I doubt he’s a “Cub hater”. And if he is, that weakens Doc’s argument, anyway. There were a lot of things wrong with his argument.
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
Sarcastic
Hollandsworth is a former Cub and the pre & post Cub game guy, hardly a hater which I thought would be clear.
Todd Hollandsworth, Les Grobstein & Brian Hanley all agree that Zambrano threw at Pods & Wise. All three are Cubs fans, outside the putdowns of drew.
DrCrawdad - June 29, 2009
I don't think Z threw at Wise
I do think Denks threw at Freel, tho. Why no mention of that? Freel handled it perfectly.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Man, that was awesome...
“Getting that dirt off his shoulder” and then blowing it towards the mound… definitely loved seeing that!
kanderber - June 28, 2009
especially when the Cubs were down 5-0
I thought it was bush league on Freels part, " Hey Freel how about getting your average above .180"
Grockcubs - June 28, 2009
Bush league...
on Freel’s part?! He just got plunked for no fault of his own! I would’ve done the same damn thing!
kanderber - June 28, 2009
I think he should do it more often
Maybe he can get is OBP up to .300
Worf - June 28, 2009
Or maybe even .200!
Worf - June 28, 2009
hes been on the DL for the majority of the season
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
wow.
he’s just back off the DL, just called back up with the club, he steals two bases, gets hit by a pitch, is the Cubs player of the game… and you fault him for that?
Ok.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
No, that definitely wasn't bush league...
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
I played
in a different time. When your team is traiing and sleepwalking through a game, and whether Freel is hitting .140 or .340, to brush his shoulder and act like a bad ass, I would of hit him again.
Grockcubs - June 28, 2009
Very funny!
I liked Freel’s smart play yesterday when he ran in from 3rd on the ground ball to Alexei Ramirez. That was a very smart play on his part and I love when guys play like that. Of course I didn’t like that it happened to the my favorite team, but great play nonetheless.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
Freel is easy to like. He plays baseball like it should be played.
And yes, Sori, I wish you did also….
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
If only Freel could actually, you know, hit.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Cubs can't do anything, and seem to be doing nothing about it
I took that from RosenBlog. Sori, Bradley, Dome how many million & years tied up in these guys ? Dome holds the record for a centerfielder playing with his back stuck
to the wall. How many catchable balls fall in front of this guy ? Al is right about Bradley
not a good fit . Hendry must have been drunk when he thought this was a good idea.
Z I said last year this guy shoulf be traded . He is Mental Board Jr. He was just itching
to get into it today. He will be in a full sized magilla b4 the season is over. It’s over fellas
heading South just past Memphis all aboard !
DaTruth - June 28, 2009
Most people
on here, like myself, thought the Cubs should’ve signed Dunn instead of Bradley. What a colossal mistake by JH.
propheteer - June 28, 2009
Abreu, but definitely not Bradley.
I’m also a big believer in clubhouse chemistry though. I know that not everybody is though, but at this point I think anyone of us would rather have Dunn or Abreu instead of MB.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Actually,
for the record, I was higher on Bobby Abreu, or acquiring Nick Swisher.
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
i personally dont see what hendry saw in bradley that dunn ibanez or abreu didnt have
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
especially considering Abreu was much cheaper.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Younger than ibanez and abreu
better defense than dunn.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
When he can get in the lineup...
for more than 120 games, which he can’t unless he’s able to DH at least some of that time.
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
Dunn is never hurt
propheteer - June 28, 2009
Bradley
is a better all around player. You have to play defense in the NL.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
With all due respect, Drew
Bradley has NEVER played more than 30 games in the outfield. How can you call him a better all around player than Abreu?
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Well. I don’t know much about Abreu, but I was thinking about Dunn.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
ah, gotcha.
well Abreu, he has never played fewer than 151 games, is a serviceable outfielder (good arm), and is a career .300 hitter. He was signed by the Angels for 1 yr, $8 mil. And best of all, he’s a class guy. Definitely a winner, and I think it’s obvious that the Angels got a hell of a better deal than we did this offseason.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Well
Those are certainly nice numbers. However, I’m not going to judge any deals till after the season is over. It’s June 28th. Lots of baseball left to play.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
fair enough.
and for what it’s worth, I very much hope you’re right. Sadly though, I think I am. :(
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Hindsight.
There was no reason going in to this year to believe Bradley would be worse than Abreu.
Abreu 2008: .296 AVG with .843 OPS
Bradley 2008: .321 AVG with .999 OPS
Now, the amount better might not be worth the extra time or millions Bradley got, and you certainly have to wish they’d taken injury history / rage issues in to account, but claiming we screwed up because Bradley isn’t hitting as well as Abreu this year is purely a hindsight argument. There was no way to see the production being so bad.
AndrewJStone - June 28, 2009
More and more...
… that .999 OPS Bradley put up last year looks like the outlier in his career, not something we could have expected.
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
Fair enough, but that is still an hindsight argument.
At the time of his signing, the injury issues and headcase history were known and could have been forecast to continue in to the future, as many rightly did at the time.
Nobody could have forecast the catastrophic drop off in production.
AndrewJStone - June 29, 2009
No
but the length of his contract, and money guaranteed to him could’ve been a big warning sign though. I’d much rather have Dunn’s awful defense on a one-year deal.
propheteer - June 29, 2009
Bradley never played more than 30 games in the OF?
Actually… http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bradlmi01.shtml
2000: 40 in CF, 0 as DH
2001: 60 in CF, 13 in LF, 3 in RF, 1 as DH
2002: 94 in CF, 1 as DH
2003: 93 in CF, 8 as DH
2004: 93 in CF, 31 in RF, 17 in LF, 0 as DH
2005: 73 in CF, 0 as DH
2006: 94 in RF, 1 as DH
2007: 40 in LF, 15 in CF, 4 in RF, 0 as DH
2008: 19 in RF, 1 in LF, 97 as DH
2008 is the only year Bradley was used as a designated hitter very much; he’s appeared in almost 7 times as many games in OF as DH over his career, many of those in center.
aldimond - June 29, 2009
Thank you!
It’s refreshing when stats make an appearance. Sadly, that’s far too rare around here…
This place is like an Oprah episode with everyone sitting around talking about their feelings….Ugh.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
I should note...
I’m not singling out AmbrosiaDreams here. I meant this entire thread. AD seemed to be trying to use stats; s/he just got them wrong.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
JER-RY! JER-RY!
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
You're right of course....
Jerry Springer is more apropos. :)
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
Yup... sure showed it!
The man is a born DH and you say he’s a better fit for the NL?
Worf - June 28, 2009
Ding!Ding!Ding!Ding!
Give that man a prize!
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
And when Bradley does play in the outfield, he doesn't exactly make the case for a gold-glove award.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
I'm not on one side of this argument or another
But Bradley has been MORE than a pleasant surprise in the field. He hustles on every play that I see and aside from throwing the ball in the stands, seems to make the better decision.
This wouldn’t even be a topic of conversation if he was hitting.
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Did I say he hasn't been a pleasant surprise...?
Nope, sure didn’t.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
I am saying he has. I feel confident with Bradley in right.
heine41 - June 28, 2009
I'm not questioning his effort. He definitely gives it his all out there.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
but he frequently dives for the ball
that, according to kanderber, establishes that he’s giving 100%.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
don't be
such a douche
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Inappropriate
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
And not really fair from a logic standpoint.
If kanderber wants to apply the argument to one play, why can drew not apply it to another?
AndrewJStone - June 28, 2009
The biggest mistake wasn't just signing Bradley...
It was giving him the 3 years (the 3rd year is pretty much a lock). If Bradley wanted to play here so bad, and given his checkered past, sign him to an incentive laden 1-year deal with an option or something. Dunn and Abreu probably could’ve been had for 1-year deals.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Abreu was had for a one year deal...
the Angels got him for 1 yr, 8 mil
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Right...
And I’m sure Dunn would’ve taken one year with the Cubs over two with the Nats.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
really?
Worf would disagree with you — he thinks baseball players are all about money.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
In some cases it may be true...
But Dunn’s numbers in Wrigley were great, he talked about wanting to be a Cub… I just don’t think he turns down a fair 1-year deal with us. Plus there was talk because of the lack of interest, he was going to take only a year anyway and hope to cash in next off-season.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Peavy
wanted to be a Cub too. I dunno.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Peavy wasn't a free agent.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
But we all want to be Cubs!
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Correction
He thinks baseball is all about money. :-)
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Dunn said he really wanted to be a Cub
propheteer - June 28, 2009
The only thing I can't wrap my head around
is what JH is waiting for. This team has looked listless for the better part of almost 2 months now. Luckily for us, Milwaukee and St. Louis are keeping us in this thing, but St. Louis is already wheeling and dealing and are rumored to be hot after Matt Holliday. We are NOT going to win the division with this team, and there’s no sense in waiting until the trade deadline to add the missing pieces. Get it done Jim, get it done.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Exactly....
….which scares me into thinking that we make not make ANY moves, if we haven’t already, and think that the return of Rami is going to cure everything.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
yes, i'm starting to think we won't make any real moves.
and i think the ownership situation might be the problem.
buckmulligan - June 28, 2009
I'm just frustrated because I want to make my team better
and there is absolutely nothing I can do about it. Normally, I don’t mind this. Except now, when I have lost 90% of my faith in our leadership. Come on Jim…time to work for your job. It’s not too late.
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Lou needs to go
They don’t look ready, just like the playoffs the last two years.
goddess - June 28, 2009
I don't think this teams struggles have anything to do with Lou
other than his advocating for a LHB in the offseason
heine41 - June 28, 2009
And I don't even think that is a problem
Getting more left-handed isn’t exactly a radical idea.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
I could argue that it is a rational idea
Just the pieces we moved and the moves we made in order to do it is where the mistakes were made
heine41 - June 28, 2009
In hindsight
perhaps. The jury still is out on that.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
Correct.
I say that standing here on June 27th, Hendry very well could look like a genius on Oct 17th, and I pray thats the case
heine41 - June 28, 2009
From our lips
to the baseball gods’ ears.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
:::crosses fingers::::
and says 7 hail yogi’s
heine41 - June 28, 2009
To a certain extent, though
all Lou can do is make out the lineup card. He can’t go on the field and perform. I think if half of our lineup was hitting over .245 would help much more than dumping Lou Piniella.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Yep.
Lou can’t hit for the players with RISP.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Unlike some other years, the right players are in place
but they aren’t doing their jobs. That’s the bottom line.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
exactly.
and that’s why it’s so rediculous to call for Lou’s beheading. What more can we expect the man to do?
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
agreed
I’d hate for them to make Lou a scapegoat like Gerald Perry.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
By that logic
By that logic a manager should never get fired. The team isn’t prepared. That’s the managers problem. I haven’t liked Lou from the beginning and as time goes on he hasn’t done anything to change my mind.
goddess - June 28, 2009
yeah.
he’s only won the division both years he’s been here.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
so you admit your biased..
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
yep
didn’t like him from the beginning? Lou had some pretty good credentials coming in…
LT - June 28, 2009
The Cubs have never made the playoffs two times in a row in my lifetime. So he's done one hell of job.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Prior to last year.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Sometimes...
… a manager has to go, to make a statement. Look what it did for the Rockies this year.
It may be getting toward that time.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Wasn't that Gerald Perry's dismissal?
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Not enough.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Not enough is right, but
Why not remove the more guilty party?
You want to make a splash to save your job, Crane? Fire Hendry.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Who would you replace him with?
Serious question.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
That's probably more
than a “off the top of your head” question, but I think there are plenty of very smart young minds out there that could spend 130 mil much more efficiently than Hendry. Kim Ng is supposed to be brilliant, for example.
I don;t think Hendry goes anywhere until ownership is resolved, but that in no way means I think he derves the job at all. I think he is a below-average GM with top financial backing.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
He's had a really bad year, that's for sure.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
tomas' suggestion isn't a bad one
I’d give Randy Bush an interview to gauge how he’d correct the course, too.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Amen
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Are you seriously advocating
the Cubs fire Lou? Seriously?
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
Yes, I just might be to that point.
Something has to happen to REALLY shake up this team. Maybe that’s it. I’ll reserve judgment till the All-Star break.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
In the words of Hall and Oates
I can’t go for that. I don’t think the situation is nearly dire enough for that. Plus, I think Lou knows what he’s doing.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
I used to think that, too.
But I’m beginning to wonder. And yes, I DO think the situation is getting toward “dire”. This team should be winning more games than this.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Hall and Oates reference?
wow. Awesome. :D
I’m not ready to give up on Lou either.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I don't know
about that. Doesn’t he have another year on his contract after this? If this is his last year, and he’s retiring after this, and he’s given up, then maybe.
But I think Lou has proven to me that he knows how to manage, and the guys in the clubhouse need to get themselves going rather than waiting for Lou to yell and scream them into performing.
I also suspect that Lou’s hands may be tied into keeping Soriano in the lead-off spot, which might be hurting the team offensively as much as anything.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
It's Happening?!?!?!?!?!
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
no, he can also try to force the issue a bit on offense.
we are absolutely dreadful at bringing runners in, especially when we have them at third with less than two outs. lou can put a squeeze on every once in a while, and he should. he could also put on some hit and runs, etc. instead, he just lets these guys swing away, hoping they’ll break out of it. i’d like to see lou start to micromanage a bit.
buckmulligan - June 28, 2009
I agree
when you have a bunch of guys not driving in runs on their own, it’s typical of a manager to play hit and run or run and hit, squeeze plays, whatever to get the guys concentrating on simply putting the ball in play instead of trying to hit 5 run home runs. We have had a fair amount of chances to drop a squeeze play to try and generate some runs. But , to be fair, we don’t bunt very well as a team.
I say, if what’s been happening isn’t working, gotta try something else. If the guys aren’t driving in the runners on third base at all, you have to force the issue. I would love to know how we rate as a team in sac flies. It seems we never get them when we need them.
BigJohnAZ - June 29, 2009
if we are not one the worst in the league at getting in a runner from third base or with less than two outs, or at least in the bottom 3 in the league, i will eat my hat.
buckmulligan - June 29, 2009
You may be right...
But I don’t think that Lou signed on to try to win games for two months with the like of Andres Blanco, Ryan Freel, and David Patton.
Honestly, at 136 million in payroll, and a new owner coming on board, I’d expect anything less than a playoff appearance ensures that Jim Hendry is shown the door, not Piniella. Just my opinion.
Damen Jackson - June 28, 2009
Good point
Grockcubs - June 28, 2009
Could be worse
I’d say if this team finishes more towards the cellar, Lou would probably retire and it wouldn’t be long before Jim Hendry is shown the door. What incentive would Lou have to stick around? What incentive would an owner have to keep Hendry around with how he bloated the payroll and drove a first place team into the ground?
Ace Venom - June 29, 2009
maybe lou needs to go,
but if we lose him now, i certainly don’t see this team turning it around. i’d rather wait until the offseason.
buckmulligan - June 28, 2009
Right...
If anything, I see this team just packing it in without Lou. He still instills some element of fear into the players, without him, I think it could only get worse.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Often...
… when a manager with a “hardass” reputation is replaced, the team goes on a hot streak simply because they relax.
Best example: 1982 Brewers. Fired noted hardass Buck Rodgers when the team, which had made the split-season playoffs the year before, was floundering at 23-24. Harvey Kuenn, noted nice guy who owned a bar near the ballpark, took over and the Brewers took off, going 72-43 the rest of the year.
There are others, but that’s the top one I can think of. It happens.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Wasn't Torborg the same hard-assed guy for the Marlins in 2003?
I remember reading that Jack McKeon’s first words to his new team was “Have some fun!”
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
Yes!
That’s true too.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Buck Rodgers' career didn't recover
for 500 years.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Looks like
first team to 85 wins, claims the division.
Pittsburgh will give us problems. I get the sense that this team believes it can turn it on when it wants. They see that they are only 3.5 back, and figure that is nothing, we will get it going. Time is running out.
I don’t know it just looks like one of those years to be frustrated throughout the whole summer.
Grockcubs - June 28, 2009
this year reminds me so much of 2004.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
IIRC
2004 was not a fun year… and I’m pretty sure I remember correctly.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
high expectations
“in it” for most of the summer. Had a 1 game lead in the WC in the last week of the year and then lost like 8 of 11 or something like that. It just felt like that team thought they SHOULD win, and didn’t seem to put forth 100% effort all of the time.
ambrosiadreams - June 28, 2009
Agreed
And with 2004 in mind… I remember a big mid-season trade, and thinking Nomar was going to march us to the promised land.
This year, there’s a good chance a trade won’t fix things. But better play might.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
and don't you think a big trade....might.....induce better play?
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Sure! Hope springs eternal.
I’m just saying after the Nomar trade in 2004, I was sure the play would improve. It did not.
And I agree with AD… this season does feel like 2004.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
It didn't improve in 2004
because a lot of the players were no-account idiots (Sammy, Hawkins, Alou, Mercker) led by a no-account manager who allowed the inmates to run the asylum.
This manager is better, and these players are better, both in ability and in demeanor (the Bradley incident aside).
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
I really don't think that's true
In fact, I think they’re trying too hard.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
i agree, and since almost no one will be going to the ASG this year hopefully theyll relax and make a push for the division title
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
I agree 100%.
The question is, how do you get an athlete to STOP doing that?
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
well, for one, i'd like to see lou start taking some of the decisions out of their hands.
instead of letting them go play the game, swing away, etc., how about putting on more plays (hit and run, squeeze, etc.)? force them to think small.
buckmulligan - June 28, 2009
I agree
I’m not a big fan of the sacrifice bunt, but sometimes something different needs to be done.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Yep
If we aren’t moving runners over the traditional way, you have to do it any way you can. How many times have we complained about the hitters not having productive outs? Their situational hitting comes and goes.
BigJohnAZ - June 29, 2009
Time is not running out when you are 3.5 back
Unless it is September
heine41 - June 28, 2009
If I saw ANY progress with this club, I'd agree...
but when you don’t, you have to wonder.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
progress can happen after July 1st
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Well, it's not a light switch
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
I believe it is.
See the 2007 Chicago Cubs, or the 2007 Colorado Rockies
heine41 - June 28, 2009
See the 2003 Chicago Cubs
That team was muddling along at .500 until Ramirez and Lofton showed up.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
with the key being: "acquiring 2 exceptional players"
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
Well, one of those players
is coming back soon, perhaps even later this week. The other one? We’ll see what JH has up his sleeve.
The other thing is that this team doesn’t necessarily need an outside jolt. The right players are there. Remember, in 2003 Mark Bellhorn and Lenny Harris were playing third base.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
I'd rather
not rush Rami. If we can keep up with the Cards and Suds for the next two weeks, that’s early enough for him.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Those two weeks say a lot about IF they CAN keep pace
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
I agree.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I hear you
But if he’s feeling OK, I’d bring him back ASAP. Those Suds and ’Birds series before the ASB are looking pretty big right now.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
Yes, indeed.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
surely we're not going to expect him to hit
when he gets back. he’s going to be weak and rusty.
buckmulligan - June 28, 2009
Of course I'm expecting him to hit
Maybe not hit .350 or whatever, but yes, I’m expecting him to hit.
I’m also expecting him to restore order to the lineup.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
I'm expecting him to be really bad for a month or so
and then respectable, with a few hot steaks. i don’t expect to see a lot of power.
buckmulligan - June 28, 2009
Honestly
Expect him to blow chuncks…he had a dislocated right shoulder – I dont think we will see the normal Ramirez this year at all
hansman1982 - June 28, 2009
I don't think he will suck
or be the 2nd coming of Albert Pujols. He’ll probably be in the middle. I hope the added pressure of him having to be the savior won’t affect him, have him trying to much and putting even MORE pressure on the others who are stifling under it.
How many times does a player have a major injury and simply pick up where they left off? The first 2-3 weeks will be like ST again. I hope he can drive in some timely runs and help this team relax. Just by having back at the hot corner wil be a big plus.
BigJohnAZ - June 29, 2009
see Houston Astros of 05 or Marlins of 03
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
Astros and Marlins
I remember that Jack McKeon being named manager started the Marlins on their tear, but did anything happen to the Astros in 2005 that got them going?
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Garner
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Yep.
Rockies won 17 of their last 20 games.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Recall in 2007 that the Rockies were 4 behind San Diego
on Sept 20 – and won the division in a playoff game after the season ended. They then swept Arizona & the Phillies in the Division & Championship Series. This from a mediocre team that spent most of that season in 4th & 5th place.
As far as I am concered it ain’t over ‘till it’s over, cause crazy shi*t always happens in this game.
JFCubFan - June 28, 2009
Rockies won 21 of their last 22. If that isn't flipping a switch, I don't know what is
And this years Cubs are a better team, with a better manager
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Rockies were an exception, not the norm.
But, sure, it could happen.
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
Especially with that avatar
Was it over when the Germans attacked Pearl Harbor?
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Forget it, he's rolling
BleedsbluinMI - June 28, 2009
Classic Bob Brenly today...
1. “How can anyone complain or be concerned about Jake Fox playing left field, when that’s the type of defense we get every day out there?” (After a play Fonzie seemed to give up on)
2. “The White Sox say he’s the SS of the future, but Ramirez is absolutely terrified of contact around second base and will do anything to avoid it.”
carmen_fanzone - June 28, 2009
Actually, the White Sox radio announcers said the same thing about Ramirez and about Fonzie....
So it is obvious to the most casual observer :-)
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
Not really sure
While my head says the 2009 Cubs are pretty much shot despite being only 3.5 games back, my heart says it’s not insurmountable. This division is up for grabs, but the Cubs have not shown they can do what it takes to make gains. You can fill a team with All-Stars, but you can’t always expect good things to happen. Instead, what you’ve got is a giant payroll with just about nothing to show for it. The Cubs are skidding towards a fourth or fifth place finish in the division, but that may not happen if they actually play up to their level of talent. Just remember that their record shows more about what kind of team they are than the level of talent on the field.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Is this Ace from ESPN.com?
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
The one in the same head case
Often imitated, but there’s only one Ace Venom.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Lol. It's me, TyHoward24.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Well ain't that somethin?
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Lol, yep, it sure is. Too many damn trolls, so I left.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
See...
The Yankees of the last 10 years.
hansman1982 - June 28, 2009
Hope for Bradley
consider the 2004 season: Bradley was traded to the Dodgers just days before the season after getting into a fight with the manager. Expectations were pretty high after a .321/.421/.501 the year prior. He was switching from the AL to the NL.
In April and May, Milt put up a .246/.343/.402, then things got worse in June with a 120/ .185 /.200 line and had the infamous ball-throwing meltdown.
However, after that, Uncle Milty put up a 406 /.465 /.656 in July and finished with a respectable, while unspectacular season line of 276/ .370/ .447.
NB: his season ended early after another tirade tore his knee up. But still, he has struggled early with new teams/leagues and come out ok. So maybe there is hope. I guess I’ll be patient, because booing/lamenting won’t help, and we’re stuck with him for 2.5 more years.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Well then, maybe some other team knows this and can trade for him.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
I don't think
trading him now would be a wise move.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Why?
He has shown ZERO signs of turning things around.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Unless he forgot completely
how to play baseball, or he’s injured, he’ll turn it around. He has way too much track record of being a very, very good hitter to think this is his new norm. I posted above that in 04 he had a very similar April-June and then had a monster July and played relatively well the rest of teh way.
If we traded him now, we’d be paying most of his salary and getting nothing of substance in return. If we wait, maybe he’ll improve and we can either trade him for something better or take advantage of his production. If he has forgotten how to play baseball, we can trade him for nothing and pay his salary in another year or so.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
I'll re-examine my thoughts about Bradley after the All-Star break.
That gives him 13 games to show me something.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
I don't think he has forgotten anything and he's a very talented player.
But he may not be able to deal with the pressure here and to me that’s the issue (and that was the issue with him before they signed him). He’s going to have his injuries and miss some games but if he can’t put it together mentally here then he may never produce here like he is capable. He should have sought $30 million from a market with less pressure but there probably weren’t any $30 million sure thing offers from small markets.
DudeVf11 - June 29, 2009
This would be a stunning turnaround for MB.
I hope tat it happens but I am not counting on it. He doesn’t appear to want to play in the Chicago pressure cooker and he doesn’t have to produce for his next contract.
DudeVf11 - June 29, 2009
Any word on when Aramis starts minor-league rehab?
Curtain Jerker - June 28, 2009
hell probably start sometime this week, he just took some more BP today
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
enough with the frickin bp
get his ass out there…and yes I know this irrational but its how I really feel.
DC Cubbie - June 28, 2009
do that before he's ready
and you risk injuring him even more significantly.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Agreed on that
If it’s irrationa, DC, why the hairy frick are you suggesting it? Do better next time.
Worf - June 28, 2009
not soon enough
heine41 - June 28, 2009
We still have some hope that he'll be back before the ASB. Doubt it, but it's possible.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Can the Cubs please start a winning streak tomorrow?
that would make me extremely happy.
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
+ a bajizillion x infinity
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Chemistry vs. Numbers
I’m starting the think that the two might go hand in hand. Having “the right mix” may bring out a little extra in players, and conversely having a lineup full of .800 or better OPSs makes for positive, “pick each other up” dugout and clubhouse. Chicken and egg stuff.
Another interesting thought I had – supposing there are two players available with similar career numbers (again, let’s use OPS). Let’s say their ages are relatively similar, give or take a year or two. Let’s even say for the sake of Lou that they both bat from the same side of the plate. Given all that, does it still make a difference which one of the two you pick for your lineup? Can Player A be a better fit despite his statistics being identical to Player B?
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Agreed
As does the belief the guy behind you will pick you up if things don’t go your way at the plate
heine41 - June 28, 2009
Part of the reason why the Cubs did so well in 2008
It seemed as if everyone clicked at the right time and everything went right up until September and crashed and burned in October.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Let's get this crash and burning out of the way now...
And heat up around July through October.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
All we need
Is our version of the Manny trade. The big problem is that our outfield is loaded.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Yes, all we need
is to get the best hitter in baseball.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
I like that idea...
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
This year
someone new seems to step up to be the goat every day. If the starting pitching is good, the bullpen blows it. If the pitching is good, nobody hits. That, and everyone is having a reverse-career year.
Last season many played at career-best levels, and there was a new hero daily.
Whoever compared this season to 04 nailed it.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
I compared it to '05...
But I’m staying optimistic and hoping 2009 plays itself out in it’s own unique and hopefully positive way.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
And we hit with two outs, something this years team has a lot of difficulty doing.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
You can do that?
I didn’t get a copy of that memo. I’ve been having problems with my TPS reports too.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Caption
Z: I don’t know Geo, the girl behind the backstop looks like a 10 to me.
Geo: No, she’s definitely an 8.
wrigleyrocker12 - June 28, 2009
thats too chill. even for me
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
My Caption
Zambrano: What do you mean I have something caught between my teeth?
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Cubs Run Differential is currently 0
We’ve given up as many as we’ve scored.
Apologies if saying “we” gets on your nerves.
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Bryce Harper here we come?
kidding of course, but this does not look like a playoff team despite many in the media reassurance we’ll still win the division
bren - June 28, 2009
I read Wojo's column on ESPN yesterday and he said...
…even though we are struggling, we will win the division. He went on a soap box in the entire article, then proceeded to say the Cubs were going to win the Central. Made no sense to me.
CUBSfaninYANKEEcountry - June 28, 2009
Ive read that a few places
like its a forgone conclusion, mostly b/c of our pitching, so they say.
bren - June 28, 2009
Caption
No, I had no idea where the hell that ball was going. But I did save money on car insurance by switching to Geico.
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Win!
I’m not Al, but I think we have a winner.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
I like this one too.
Winner!
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
+1 rec'd
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I'm sure Toronto could part with Kevin Millar
He’s no DeRosa when it comes to changing water to wine, but I hear tell he helps keep the clubhouse loose. ;-)
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
That's who Al wanted
before the season.
LT - June 28, 2009
Right
I just noticed Al started posting in here so I thought I’d have some fun.
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Carry on
LT - June 28, 2009
We need some fun.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Sigh.
Yes, I did. His performance, clearly, wouldn’t make him worth it.
But someone suggested the Blue Jays might be willing to part with Marco Scutaro. Might be worth it.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
I saw the Scutaro suggestion, and it's not a bad one
Another guy having a quiet but decent year is Adam Kennedy with Oakland. .285 BA, .350ish OBP, can play 3rd, and OMG he bats lefty!
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
Interesting.
Kennedy is almost certainly available.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
really hot start
cool last month though. It would be a reverse DeRosa (as in ex-Card who they probably should have kept).
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
Well, that didn't take long... ;-)
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
OK, so I had a bad day, too.
;-)
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
I was at the game and I thought........
Soriano’s play in left was shaky at best again
Clutche - June 28, 2009
PHOTO CAPTION
Zambrano:
“I’m not sure if I feel anything yet, man. How fast does this stuff kick in?”
Geo:
“It’s creeper, man. Give it a minute.”
Goodie1969 - June 28, 2009
It's creeper... Ha. LOL.
Jimmyeatworld - June 28, 2009
Maybe the Cubs should do their annual rookie "hazing" now instead of waiting for the end of the season
That ought to loosen things up a bit.
FWIW: here’s what the Reds did to their rookies on a getaway day at Wrigley back in 2004.
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
Really need to
get that collapse function back.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
I can think of six guys that would agree with you...
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
Oh boy I finally get to say this!
Do. Not. Want.
CaliCub - June 28, 2009
hahaha...excellent
Curtain Jerker - June 28, 2009
Got ID's for that photo?
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Caption
Z: Who took this picture of us?
S: Huh.
Z: I said, "Who took this picture of us?"
S: Huh!
Z: What?
S: Huh.
Z: If you can’t hear me, take your mask off. Who is the photographer?
S: Who is on first.
Z: I don’t know.
S: Third base!
mattvegas - June 28, 2009
The day the Cubs start to chilax is the day they will start to play and win consistently
I have a feeling that they just want to prove to everybody that all the hype was deserved. Easier said than done though.
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
I think you're right.
So exactly how are they going to accomplish that, with players and a manager as tightassed as they come right now?
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
weed?
Clutche - June 28, 2009
Gotta change things up a bit.....Some teams change managers. Some teams trade for
players (e.g., Manny). Some teams get rid of players (e.g., Barrett).
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
we made several trades and where did that get us?
Clutche - June 28, 2009
If Bradley is as bad as people think he is
i guess he’s gotta go. Hendry is a really creative GM. I think he can find something in his bag of tricks if it ever gets to that point.
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
They should all got out
and get drunk together. Seriously.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
Couldn't hurt.
Just take cabs home.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
make sure to do it
in a dumpster-free zone.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Tightassed...
Thanks Al, that’s the first time I’ve laughed in a while. Although, it seems Lou would be looseassed because all he does is sit on the bench with his thumb up there waving his arms saying “What can I do?”
cubfanwill - June 28, 2009
Maybe we better not ask where that thumb has been.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Ha ha
cubfanwill - June 28, 2009
I'm not giving up on Bradley just yet but if there's a way
to get rid of him and somehow get Dunn, I think the move has to be made. I’ll admit i was a bradley supporter from the get go, but I totally overlooked Dunn’s consistency. 40 HRs and 100 RBIs are pretty damn good, and you could probably add a few more to the totals playing at Wrigley. :( I wish Hendry saw this.
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
I like MB...but let's say that he's bad for "chemistry"....in that case....
who in MLB will take him away from us? Anyone have any ideas?
zevkalman - June 28, 2009
I don't know what we would get in return but
the teams i see trading for Bradley: NYM, NYY, DET, LAA
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
well people said he was bad for team chemistry
before the cubs signed him, but that didn’t stop hendry from overpaying him. i don’t really have any good answers to your question of who exactly would take him, but i should think that there has to be some team out there willing to take the chance
murphymj - June 28, 2009
plenty of people
said he was an excellent team player as well.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
If MB wants to be in a place...
where no one will pay attention to him. DC would be the perfect fit.
Chris Dobbertean - June 28, 2009
the only thing would be the money
i could actually see the nats do a dunn for bradley swap with the cubs giving them some young pitching
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
I agree.
It actually makes some sense. Bradley, presumably, would hit with the pressure off him in DC. The Nats could get some young pitching, which they need (Ascanio? Stevens?). And the Cubs would get a RF who would rake AND stay in the lineup every day.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Why would the Nats want Bradley?
cubfanwill - June 28, 2009
anything is possible.
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
The big issue with the Nats...
is the GM situation. When Bowden was running the show, he was willing to take on troubled players (Elijah Dukes, anyone?), but with him out of the picture, maybe the philosophy’s changed.
Then again, it is the Nats…
Chris Dobbertean - June 28, 2009
I think Bradley has burned enough bridges
No one is going to want to take him now. The worst case scenario is to just pay him to play somewhere else.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
I Think MLBT
has an article stating the Nats are trying to get rid of their players that carry baggage?? MB might not fit there.
I can see the Mets taking him ….
cozmotaylor123 - June 28, 2009
It appears
they are trying to change the philosophy here in DC then.
It’s so hard to tell with that franchise.
Chris Dobbertean - June 28, 2009
Maybe because they could equalize contracts getting rid of Dunn...
… and pick up a couple of pitching prospects.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Still...
I cannot see anybody wanting that guy with the way he’s played, and his history. He should have stayed in Texas, he seemed comfortable there. Plus, there’s the DH.
cubfanwill - June 28, 2009
Agreed.
Still, there are always teams that say, “We can fix that”. They’re never right, but they say it anyway.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Yes, I agree that here are teams that will say they can fix it...
…or try and deal with it. But the issue is the contract term and salary to me, so it’s more whether the Cubs will et that contract for the other team or one of those other teams has a similar bad deal that the Cubs will swap.
DudeVf11 - June 29, 2009
and we can save money
by not buying Dunn a glove, either. Because there’s no point.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
I wish MB would hit a walkoff HR
soon. I think that would go a long way to relax him and the team, AND the fans.
But then again, I thought the last laugher we had would relax us. We went right back to scuffling the next game.
This year’s Cubs are really hard to figure out. I hope the starting pitching will hold up long enough for us to sort this out and put a stranglehold on the division.
BigJohnAZ - June 29, 2009
Lou wants to manage a team, not 25 guys
he wants them all to be journeymen, no issues, just go out on the field and do your job. And in an ideal world, that would be the way it is.
But some of these people are kids, or if not kids, people who need a mentor. Somebody who would make the difference just with a couple guys and knit the fabric of this team together so that in the end whether going through injuries or the personal challenges, they can deal with anything and win.
Maybe that person was Ramirez, he’s in his 30’s, been around for awhile, been in Chicago for awhile. I would like to think that Derek is that guy, too, but maybe not for everybody.
Read this blog post by the Seattle Times beat writer and tell me that the difference between the Mariners and the Cubs right now isn’t their managers, and/or that the Mariners have somebody like Griffey. And I hate to say it but right now, watching both teams, the Mariners have a worse team, but more character than the Cubs. And they’re winning, for now, maybe not for long, but certainly progress, building, and they’ll contend.
Lou has to deal with it or winning will be all that much harder. This may be a stretch, but it sure seems that for all Lou’s experience, Don Wakamatsu in his first year is out managing him by what he’s getting out of his team.
patches23 - June 28, 2009
I think Phil Rogers is a horrible writer.
He should just cover everything except the Cubs.
I know Zambrano is crazy but seriously
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
Phil Rogers wrote that?
That’d be a -1 on his plus-minus ledger.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
lol
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
yup
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
You can read the full article
here
And Rogers starts his proposition by saying
Further, I will go against this grain here, and say that Rogers point is dead on. It seems obvious to me from the tenor of his op-ed that his suggestion to waive Zambrano is slightly tongue-in-cheek… but his larger point about how Z has continually let us down… let us down much more than he has saved this team’s neck… is valid and well made.
We needed Big Z today. He failed to keep his mind on the task. Typical.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
To his defense...
We got shut down today. He could’ve pitched 9 innings of 1-run ball and we still would’ve lost.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
I nominate that for the most useless suggestion of the year award
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
is he serious?
he should be suspended from writing about the cubs just for making that suggestion
murphymj - June 28, 2009
Dumbest. Idea. EVER.
Maybe not…but it’s damn close.
Chris Dobbertean - June 28, 2009
no, you were right the first time
worst idea to ever surface
murphymj - June 28, 2009
Just covering myself...
as I am prone to hyperbole. :)
Chris Dobbertean - June 28, 2009
What?
Really?
Curtain Jerker - June 28, 2009
He gets progressively worse...
Like Sam Smith. Just stick to your “power rankings” and ridiculous trade scenarios.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Is he as bad on radio...
as Sam is? Smith always used to put me to sleep when he would go on Tony Kornheiser’s show.
Chris Dobbertean - June 28, 2009
sam smith is just a boring person
murphymj - June 28, 2009
He's pretty bad on Chicago Tribune Live...
Especially when he starts applying his absurd logic and ideas to the Bulls and Bears.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
whut?
seriously? that’s utterly asinine.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Just wonderin'....
Is Phil Rogers aware that teams cannot place players with full NTCs on revocable waivers without their prior written consent? (It is regarded as the same thing as a trade, which can’t be made without the player’s consent.) The only thing Hendry can do is put him on unconditional release waivers; no waiver-based trade is possible.
I agree with the concept that the double-standard Lou has between Gameboard and Z must be stopped, but it would be nice with he would offer Hendry a suggestion he can actually implement.
DeRoMyHero - June 28, 2009
Read the article.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
I did.
That’s why I made the comment I did — he is suggesting something that violates MLB rules.
DeRoMyHero - June 28, 2009
I don't believe
the point of his article was to highlight the intricacies of MLB transactions and their accompanying rules.
I believe his point was more about Zambrano’s glaring inability to provide leadership to this team.
Reddevil - June 28, 2009
Then he should talk about that
instead of coming up with idiotic ideas.
jerry morales rules - June 29, 2009
Perhaps...
or maybe he finds the indignation above to be no more than pedantic quibbling.
Obviously I wouldn’t speak for Phil, but it does strike me as a possibility… because that is exactly what I would call it.
Reddevil - June 29, 2009
Phil...
…needs to up the dose on his medication.
MPH73 - June 29, 2009
Who else could we possibly trade for...
Some people mentioned Scutaro, how about Adam Kennedy? Putting up some decent numbers, he’s a lefty, possibly lead-off, and is in the last year of his contract with the A’s.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Risky.
Kennedy’s having the best year of his career, by far. Risk: he’ll stop.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
apply
that same logic to Bradley, and that’s why I don’t want to trade him.
tomas21 - June 28, 2009
That's reverse logic.
Much easier to STOP hitting than to START.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
Scrappy.....
Shanghai Badger - June 28, 2009
Al
Are you aware that Tony LaRussa benched Kennedy last year in favor of…
Aaron Miles???
DeRoMyHero - June 28, 2009
Yes.
Pretty freaky how things change, isn’t it?
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
I think that had to do with personalities
although I’m going off of the blog chatter at the time.
ol Pete - June 29, 2009
I was unfortunately at todays game.
We looked awful. Todays crowd was very rowdy compared to Fridays. We had a big fight break out in the section behind us in the upper deck. Two Cubs fans kicked the CRAP out of a Sox fan. Another fight broke out below us, right behind the Cubs dugout. At one point someone throw a beer at someone else in the crowd and it landed in Cubs bullpen. Marmol got soaked and did not look happy.
Everyone has bad apples in their fan base, certainly we do. But of all the games I’ve ever been to, Sox fans are the worst. They seem to take more joy in the Cubs losing than their own team winning. It seemed like 1 out of every 3 shirts was anti-Cubs. My gf (Sox fan) was pretty embarrassed by her fellow fans, I couldn’t blame her.
cubswynn - June 28, 2009
Hmmm.
Where I was, in the RF corner, it was pretty peaceful. Yesterday, in the LF bleachers, there were so many drunk idiots — both Cub AND Sox fans — who simply refused to sit down, it was ridiculous.
Al Yellon - June 28, 2009
No excuse to throw beer on someone
But it’s not like fans are lining up to buy Marmol a beer either.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Yeah I don't think it was aimed at Marmol.
But for a split second there, it looked like things could get out of control and the Cubs bullpen was going to get into it with the fans. Luckily security ushered them under some cover quickly.
cubswynn - June 28, 2009
"they seem to...
take more joy in the cubs losing than their own team winning"…that is because they are completely aware that their team will forever play in the shadows of the chicago cubs. it does not matter what either team does, the white sox will always be lower on the totem pole of chicago power. if you think about it, that would be extremely frustrating as a sox fan
murphymj - June 28, 2009
Oh it's classic little man syndrome.
Sorta sad because they’ve got some good long history, a nice stadium, and some passionate fans. Really makes me appreciate Cardinals fans (I can’t believe I just said that). Although we have a bitter rivalry, they seem to be a little bit mature about it.
cubswynn - June 28, 2009
too bad brewers fans arent like that
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
i have lived in saint louis for five years now
and i definitely appreciate cardinals fans so much more than white sox fans (and almost more than fans of any other team in mlb). cubs/cardinals is a great rivalry. that being said, screw the redbirds
murphymj - June 28, 2009
I think it starts with Pujols...
He’s probably the best player in baseball, he plays the game the right way, and he’s actually a likeable guy (except when he’s killing us).
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
Totally agree
rumors around here, though, are that pujols has voiced some frustration with the cardinals franchise since the departure of jocketty. he has apparently said some things about keeping his options open once his contract runs up
murphymj - June 28, 2009
Probably just a front...
By getting “that guy from Cleveland” and now rumors of Holliday or Dye, it seems like they’re trying to do what it takes to win.
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
well
except that guy from cleveland is, at the moment, a four month rental. Let’s see if they resign him.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
do not expect them to resign derosa
too many prospects in memphis (cards AAA)
murphymj - June 28, 2009
neither do I
which is why I don’t think it affects Puhjol’s long-term plans.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
could be true
but don’t crush my dreams of seeing pujols in blue pinstripes
murphymj - June 28, 2009
If that happens
We’re doomed.
Ace Venom - June 28, 2009
Cardinals fans are much more tolerable
than White Sox or Brewers fans.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
brewers baseball
a tradition since july 2007
those fans are a joke
murphymj - June 28, 2009
There are some good ones
I’ve met them at Miller Park. Great folks. But they’re outnumbered but the drunken, frat-boy, “Cubs Suck” fans, unfortunately.
There are many meathead Cubs fans, too, and when they get together with the meathead Brewers fans, it ain’t pretty.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
excellent point
murphymj - June 28, 2009
I always thought...
Brewers fans were just borderline Cubs fans until their team started to get better. Taking trips up to Milwaukee in ’04 and ’05, I remember Miller Park being overwhelmingly Cubs fans (locals too).
CubsBullsBears - June 28, 2009
i didnt even know the brewers had fans until 2007/2008
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
my roommate in college was a brewer fan
he says the older generation in milwaukee likes the brewers, but there are really very few die-hards amongst the younger milwaukee/wisconsin crowd.
murphymj - June 28, 2009
Hey, that sounds
like a typical Cubs/Padres tilt at Petco.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - June 28, 2009
I wish
they’d show the fights on TV. Heh. Some of those involved my get their behavior demo’d before their employers.
thermal54 - June 29, 2009
My two cents
I just finished watching the game. I missed it live as I was out scouting Carmen Pignatiello today as he faced the always tough Kansas City T-Bones. Pignatiello got beat up badly, but no I wasn’t actually there to scout him just there for family fun.
I’d like to think that this series win will propel the Sox, but as evidenced by all the talk of how the Cubs coming back and beating the Sox would propel the Cubs has been extinguished. I’ll believe it when I see it. These Crosstown games are intense for the fans and teams but the lasting effects and how they propel teams, I’m not sold on that.
Both teams are frustrating. The Sox defense is indefensible. The Cubs defense is better perhaps (but was sure ugly today.) Both teams love to strand runners on base.
The good news for the Cubs is that the teams in front of the Cubs don’t have the pitching the Cubs do. IF the Cubs could only start hitting and get improvements in the bullpen they will easily overtake those in front of them. The Cubs on paper have the best team in the NL Central and hopefully for my Cub fans friends things turn around, quickly.
The bad news for the Sox is that Detroit is better than the Sox this year, at least so far. IF Detroit stumbles and IF the Sox fire on all cylinders then yes the could win the division but I’m not betting on it at at this point.
Can’t say I feel bad about watching the Schaumburg Flyers with my family today. Interleague is over except for the make-up game. Good.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
I'm also glad interleague is over...
Back to games that actually affect the division and/or wild card standings.
Curtain Jerker - June 28, 2009
I've been kind of meh about this series this year.
There’s been a couple of classic games in there (yesterday’s Sox walkoff and the Cubs comeback at Wrigley), but for the most part I think these two teams look about the same this year, so it’s hard to cheer about who is the tallest midget. I look forward to meaningful divisional games.
Goodie1969 - June 28, 2009
Yeah that great Cub pitching really showed itself the last two games!
I think Dempster needs to walk a few more guys! What a joke! Not a big game pitcher by a long shot and we’re paying him $13 million for 3 more wonderful years. Zambrano is no ace or stopper either, he’s never consistent or levelheaded. The fact is, we have no ace on this staff, just some 2s and 3s. The bullpen is even worse. Can’t wait to see DeRosa driving in big runs for STL to drive us further down in the standings, thanks for nothing, Mr. Hendry!!
Itchy - June 28, 2009
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
There's nothing about this team besides Jake Freakin Fox to get excited about!
Is there?
Itchy - June 28, 2009
3.5 games back
on June 28th. I think that’s something to be somewhat satisfied with.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Having gone through
as much shit luck as they’ve gone through, I’m certainly thankful.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
amen
I keep hoping that one day, Bradley, or Sori, or Fonty will wake up and say “huh. I just need to do THIS.” And it will all come together, just like an A-Team plan.
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Fonty?
Mna, I forgot about him. When was the last time he drove in a meaningful run?
Itchy - June 28, 2009
each and every run
is meaningful. There is no reason to make a distinction.
Rage and Grace - June 28, 2009
Maybe, if we had shown any inclination to play a weeks worth of games once
without dumb walks by both starters and relievers and without lousy at bats and dumb baserunning. This team has shown no killer instinct and will rue the day they traded DeRosa since he’s now a Redbird.
Itchy - June 28, 2009
RUE THE DAY!
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
Oh, Christ
I’m ruing the day you learned to use a computer, Itchy.
Not Bruce Froemming - June 28, 2009
I rue reading your comments!!
And, I was writing software for these things before the internet existed.
Itchy - June 28, 2009
Rue Britannia!
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
Jason LaRue!
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
ChiChi LaRue too
chilango2 - June 29, 2009
Zambrano does have the pitching “stuff” to be an ace and a stopper, however I’m not sure he has the mental stuff to fill that role or roles.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
You nailed it.
How long do we have to wait for him to be a #1 pitcher?
PalatineRol - June 28, 2009
tough trade
Teams wait and hope to develop a talent like Zambrano. It would be awfully tough to trade that type of talent away.
DrCrawdad - June 28, 2009
I would rather have five 2s and 3s
Than a 1, 2, 3, 4 and a 5.
vonde6 - June 29, 2009
You need a 1
I’d rather have a true #1 and 4 #3s.
You’d win a lot of games that way.
Allie - June 29, 2009
wait - are we talking baseball or Go Fish!
ballhawk - June 29, 2009
Good commentary.
Dr. Crawdad. “Proving that while slow and dangerous behind the wheel, White Sox fans still do serve a purpose.” :)
Just kidding of course. I think you’re probably right about most of that. We’ll see what the Tigers do. They have issues like everyone, but are playing pretty well.
And I agree: I’m glad inter-league is (mostly) over. I want to divisional games so we can start to hash out the races….
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
Obviously the soccer game was way more entertaining
So what else is going on? Things good on your side?
chilango2 - June 28, 2009
Names that I think could be available (some names have already been mentioned on this site):
Randy Flores, Clint Barmes, Ryan Spilborghs, Kevin Kouzmanoff, Scott Schoeneweis, Jon Rauch, Chad Qualls, Chad Tracy, Jonathan Sanchez, Randy Winn, Fred Lewis, Adam Dunn, Joe Beimal, John Lannan, Christian Guzman, Jorge Cantu, Dan Uggla, Jeremy Hermida, Kiko Calero, Brad Ziegler, Orlando Cabrera, Adam Kennedy, Russell Branyon, Mark Lowe, Matt Herges, Rafael Perez, Juan Cruz, Mark Teahan, Ron Mahey, George Sherrill, Aubrey Huff, Melvin Mora, Ty Wigginton, Luke Scott, Kevin Millar, Marco Scutaro, Jason Frasor, Brian Tallet,
Some of them are questionable
lexmarklover - June 28, 2009
If obtaining any of these bums means trading away any of our few minor league studs,
just forget it!
Itchy - June 28, 2009
trades
Really there are only a few teams that are out of it and looking to trade right now—Cleve., Wash,. Ariz.
We should be looking to them and ummmm, there isn’t much there to trade for.
One name that came up early last off season in the right field/bats left discussion and then disappeared was Mark Teahan. That could have really helped us when Rami got hurt. He doesn’t make a lot of money and he could still help.
PalatineRol - June 28, 2009
correction
MOST of them are questionable
PalatineRol - June 28, 2009
nah
lexmarklover - June 29, 2009
Outside of Vitters...
only Josh could tell us who’s untouchable. I don’t remember that many studs.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - June 28, 2009
Don't trade Vitters, please!!
Itchy - June 28, 2009
Time for Some Bold Moves: 3 for sure, and 4th and 5th even bolder moves to build a future pitching dynasty.
I wholeheartedly agree that this version of the Cubs is fast sinking and stinking ala the 2007 and 2004 Cubs.
1. Replace Lou with Alan Trammell and bring up Ryne Sandberg as bench coach.
2. Trade for Carl Crawford. Give the Rays almost anything they want, but include Milton Bradley.
3. Get the Ricketts family in Wrigley as new owners NOW!
This season has already all of the earmarks of a disaster. Last place is not out of the question with the current performance, and lack of team cohesiveness. Sloppy defensive play, and lack of hitting with RISP is going to insure a last place finish, unless some bold moves occur now.
Expendable with Bradley for the Crawford trade: Jeff Smardzja; Jake Fox; Sean Marshall; Rich Harden; Aaron Miles; and possibly Carlos Marmol. Let the Rays take their pick of Bradley and Harden plus any of the others, except Marmol; If they want Marmol too, then negotiate for one of their best prospects, or spare infileders.
The Rays are close to the Wildcard spot, and probably will not make it without some changes. Bradley already considered Tama as his off-season choice. Considering a Cubs last place finish on the horizon, none of the above trade possibilities would be greatly missed, given a Cubs turn-around for the Wildcard or Division title.
The clubhouse with Alan Trammell’s leadership, and Ryno’s presence would improve 2000%!
Lou has not proven the strategic giant that was thought when he was hired. The last six playoff game fiascos
prove his inability to move this team to the next level. Even Dusty had the Cubs on the brink of going to the WS!
With the Rickett’s family in charge, the nonsense of the Trib circus will be over. Hendry would have to prove his worth by completing this bold trade, and if not would also be on his way out. Bob Brenly could easily takeover as GM for the remainder of the season.
4. & 5. My final and most controversial last changes would be to hire Mike Marshall as our pitching coach – Larry R. needs to follow Lou out the door too.
A genuine post-season championship team can still be assembled. The Rickett’s family can usher in the new era of Cubs baseball with a World Series Championship. This is whay they are purchasing this team. How can they afford to do anythng less than get this job done ASAP.
Someday…: a few BOLD moves away or another season of great hope and promise wasted due to wrong moves and even worse leadership!
Someday…
GeneticCubsFan - June 28, 2009
so, after you've crippled the bullpen
and violated the bankrupcy proceedings, what bold moves will you make next?
drewishdrewid - June 28, 2009
pick up papelbon, pujols, and the zombie of babe ruth
jesus christos - June 28, 2009
The bullpen is crippled by default with Hendry, Lou, and Rothschild in charge!
Mike Marshall can and will be able to assemble and coach what we already have into the most effective pen in the League!
Violated the bankruptcy proceedings?! I thought that was already done by Hendry, Zell, and the Tribco brass that signed off on the Bradley, DeRosa, and Wood moves!
In case you haven’t been around the Cubs history too long, there was also the era of P.K Wrigley and his bankrupt College of Coaches!
The Cardinals won the 2006 WS with a much weaker pen, and probably will march toward another post-season opportuity unless the Cubs wake up and “bankrupt” their current leadership!
Someday…
GeneticCubsFan - June 28, 2009
Ok...
Your ideas arent the best…
1. While We havent won the World Series we have gone from jokes of theNL Central to back-to-back NL Central titles – hell 12 more and call the team the Atlanta Braves and people will love sweet Bobby…err I mean Lou.
2. Getting rid of Wood was a great move – he had his career year and we sold high as so many people are wanting to do with Harden just we have a bit of a sentimental connection to Wood, hell I love Prior too and hated to see him go.
3. Are we going to platoon Crawford and Soriano?? Only 54 career games or 136 career innings at cf and none elsewhere.
Basically if we have any hope we need Jake Fox and Sean Marshall. Ramirez is going to suck for at least 2 months after he gets back if not the rest of the year.
4.
hansman1982 - June 28, 2009
we didnt “sell” wood
jesus christos - June 29, 2009
We could have resigned him had we wanted to but he simply wasnt worth to us what he wanted – multiple years…we got his peak year I believe – GREAT MOVE HENDRY!!!!
hansman1982 - June 29, 2009
Mike Marshall?
No way. First of all, most baseball teams blackballed him years ago. He is 66 years old — older than Lou — and probably ready to retire.
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
YES! "Doc" Mike Marshall!
OK Al, you scoff at his age, and probably effectiveness.
I have posted Jeff Passan’s Yahoo article from May 2007 before on BCB. I was at Mike Marshall’s 2nd Annual Pitching Research Clinic when Passan had just written his article, and the young pitchers there were reading and discussing it.
I talked extensively with Doc and Jeff Sparks. I saw Jeff Sparks pitch effectively when he had just finished an 8 hour security guard job with the flu, and show up Sunday morning due to his loyalty and devotion to Doc, and the commitment he made to be at the clinic!
Sparks was the best relief pitcher I saw anywhere in 2007! He could have been effectively pitching in ANY MLB pen…ahh but then there is the stigma, and blackballing by MLB.
My signoff, ‘Someday…’ not only refers to my beloved Cubbies, but also Doc’s methods becoming mainstream as an accepted scientific, effective, injurious-free approach to pitching.
BTW:
Bobby Cox is 68; Casey Stengel managed until he was 75; Connie Mack was 62 when he won the WS in 1930; Jack McKeon was 73 as WS manager in 2003; Leo Mazzone was 60 when he left the O’s; Ron Perranoski finished as pitching coach with the Giants at age 63; Mel Stottlemyre was 64 as pitching coach for the Yankees, and 67 when he ended his coaching with the Mariners in 2008.
NONE of the above managers or pitching coaches have the scientific plus applied pitching skills and knowledge that Mike Marshall possesses.
And WHY was he blackballed? First, due to his scientific approach to pitching that flies in the face of “traditional non-scientific” pitching coaches. Second, because he offered a fair settlement to MLB labor negotiations when he was pitching for the Mets; but his settlement ideas were threatening to the free agent lawyers who did not want to get cut out of their 10 or 15% cut for representing players in negotiations. Oh, and one of the top law firms involved in representing players just happened to be a relative of the MLB Players Union President!
The contract was settled without any of Mike’s ideas included, and the next day, the Mets released Mike – he never played for another MLB team after that.
Here is Jeff Passan’s article link:
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;ylt=AnmIPtC.VgCEfnZKrdaNYsRvLYF?slug=jp-marshall051007&prov=yhoo&type=lgns
Someday the Cubs will have a new owner; and just maybe, Someday a baseball owner with guts and an open-minded scientific view of baseball will bring Mike Marshall’s methods, if not the geriatric Doc himself, to the real modern era of baseball!
I hear that Keven Costner is starting a new independent league team in Lake County next year. Perhaps his Field of Dreams will be smart enough to seek out the “ancient” Doc Marshall to bring scientific “magic” and enlightenment, plus cost-effective pitching and training methods to baseball!
Obviously, Jim Hendry and the Cubs are too smart and have plenty of trades they can make to find the cure for a World Series caliber pitching corps, rather than give Mike Marshall a chance!
Someday…
GeneticCubsFan - July 1, 2009
Another "old" Doc Marshall's 12 year old's video
showing how an ancient blackballed scientific pitching coach has nothing effective left to help teach any pitching staff, let alone a young kid!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZtSU37OrC4
Click on more of the videos on Doc’s site to see the progression of this young man’s “non-traditional” pitching effectiveness!
Someday…
GeneticCubsFan - July 1, 2009
so… we have no chance because we have a terrible bullpen, but the cardinals won it all with a worse pen?
I think maybe you have a logic circuit in backwards.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Sending Bradley to Tama would be OK if they would take him,
but I think that Tampa is his “Final Destination”!
Sorry about the typo, but it is befitting the typo that Bradley and Hendry plus the Tribco brass signed off on during the off-season!
Come to think about it, the “off-season” for the Cubs has never ended – going back to the NLDS whimpering display of more mediocrity shown by Lou’s lack of strategic leadership.
Someday…
GeneticCubsFan - June 28, 2009
why do you think Tampa would...
a) want Bradley after what he’s shown so far this year, and
b) give up by and far their best player to do so?
I’m sorry, but Shark, Fox, Marshall, Harden, Miles? And possibly Marmol? Of that group, only Marshall comes close to being a dependable player that will give you some return on investment. Shark really hasn’t proven anything yet, TB already has a Fox in Burrell (and probably a better one), Harden could break down any moment, and Miles…. well, I’m just going to assume you got caught up in the heat of the moment and threw his name in there out of habit.
ballhawk - June 28, 2009
Wait... what?
By far their best player? Crawford isn’t even one of their best three hitters, let alone players.
kanderber - June 29, 2009
Yeah, I suppose "by and far" was a bit of a reach
Longoria and Pena are probably at the top of the list, and Zobrist has put up some incredible numbers. But The Colonel is no slouch – I think he leads the team in runs, steals, and hits.
I guess my real point was you can’t expect to go out and throw a bunch of junk at somebody and wow them with quantity to get one really good player.
ballhawk - June 29, 2009
So by Bold, you really mean...
…implausible to the point of absurdity? Really, the only one that might be feasible is one. The others are laughable.
Ross - June 29, 2009
What is laughable
and feasible is your inability to read the entire thread, and comprehend the absurdity of your remarks.
Someday…
GeneticCubsFan - July 1, 2009
Trades
Our entire OF is making a fortune. If we’re waiting to find someone to take one of their contracts off us, we’ll probably have to wait for hell to freeze over. We can whine about Bradley all we want, but I can’t see us getting rid of him. That’s especially true with the sale of the team still pending. The best we can probably hope for is Johnson coming back and using him along with Fox and Hoffpaiur as platoon starters. That means Lou would actually be willing to platoon Sori, Bradley and Fuku. The problem is that Lou seems unwilling to actually do that on a regular basis.
When Aram comes back, Fontenot and Blanco platoon at 2B. Unfortunately we’ve determined that Fonty isn’t a full time option. He already has 240 AB. Last year he had a total of 284.
In the bullpen Guzman needs to move to Marmol’s slot. The relief WHIP this year is 1.52. Last year it was 1.33. And most of the difference is BB. We’ve scored 78 runs in innings 7-9 and surrendered 112. That’s a recipe for disaster and I can’t see how it will improve with the current staff. Relievers are cheaper than position players. That’s the area I’d look for Hendry to improve.
Finally, when is the last time you’ve seen an opposing pitcher throw inside on our hitters. Why aren’t our hitters expecting that? Today we had 9K and at least 8 of them were on pitches away. It’s not brain surgery.
tharr - June 29, 2009
Eddie Robinson
Too bad that MLB doesn’t allow a team to simply tell a player to stay home like the NBA does. The Bulls decided that Eddie Robinson was a bad influence on his teammates so they told him to stay away from the team’s facilities. They had to pay him, but he was effectively removed from the team. Of course, the NBA is also the league with phantom injuries causing trips to the DL. Oh wait, what condition does Miles have now?
FrankSereno - June 29, 2009
I suppose the Cubs COULD do that with Bradley.
But they won’t.
Al Yellon - June 29, 2009
It's either that
or pay Bradley to play somewhere else. Neither solution is a good one.
Ace Venom - June 29, 2009
Just do it!
Every game he’s in the lineup is just more egg on the Cubs’ face. He has done nothing at the plate or in the field. The Cubs are a laughingstock for signing that knucklehead and it’s time to cut our losses!!
Itchy - June 29, 2009
I was just watching
video of Lou on Len and Bob’s blog. He says petty soon he’s gonna have to put other people in the lineup. My question is what other people!? We have no bench to speak of and they aren’t hitting either.
iowacubfan69 - June 29, 2009
He says that after every loss in which we don't score
he’s not going to change anything
WanderingWanderer - June 29, 2009
Ben Zobrist..
would look awesome in a cubs uniform, and our lineup..sigh.
cubbiebear316 - June 29, 2009
Should have thought of that before the season
In the wake of DeRosa’s contributions, Zobrist’s value is sky high right now. Give Hendry credit that he saw the value that a multi purpose guy like DeRosa could have on a team. Now all GM’s are looking for that type of player and Zobrist is beginning to look like one of the best guys in the league in that type of role.
jerry morales rules - June 29, 2009
I'm sorry, did you just say what I think you said?
“Give Hendry credit that he saw the value that a multi purpose guy like DeRosa could have on a team.”
Hendry saw so much value in having a player like that on the team, that he traded him away.
WanderingWanderer - June 29, 2009
He may have become lost along the way
That part I can’t explain. He may have outsmarted himself saying that if it happened with DeRosa it could happen with Miles.
jerry morales rules - June 29, 2009
Too bad Hendry got nothing useful for Mr Valuable, DeRosa!!
Time to start selling off guys and shitcan this season, there’s no way in hell that this team, as it’s currently constructed, is going to win anything.
Itchy - June 29, 2009
He did get something valuable
The stats of the three minor league pitchers that we got are all good. I don’t have the link, but check out the other DeRosa threads (I think that means all of the threads around here).
vonde6 - June 29, 2009
people clamoring for Ben Zobrist?
I thought this day would never come … and now that it has, I’m laughing my ass off.
junkhorse - June 29, 2009
Yeah, that is kind of ugly...
Cubs fans are so desperate right now… it’s kind of sad.
Ross - June 29, 2009
yeah! Who wants a utility guy that's hit 16 homers, is hitting .287
and has even stolen 8 bases.
I understand you don’t know Zobrist well, but you look like a fool when you claim wanting a guy who has been extremely valuable to his team is sad
WanderingWanderer - June 29, 2009
oooh 8 stolen bases
let me retract my initial comment and say that I’m now REALLY LAUGHING MY ASS OFF!
8 SBs!!! .287 average and 16 HRs! — this guy is a role player at best. c’mon man. we’ve got a whole team full of overpaid, under performing players (Rami aside at this point) and we’ve got people out there calling for Ben Zobrist (who two years ago was the equivalent of Asdrubal Cabrera) … the guy hit .155 and .253 in respective years prior to this one. i know, i know, he’s not an everyday player and you can’t project what he’ll do with a full season under his belt!
yeah, why not just call for Hendry to go out there and get us Skip Schumaker while he’s at it? are we that desperate yet? it sounds like it from some of you.
junkhorse - June 29, 2009
Why did Hendry
ever think MB would be able to handle this city? I think that move will be the one that ultimately costs him his job. This is like watching a train wreck that has lasted 3 months.
For some reason I’m still excited to watch the Cubs tonight at 6, despite the fact that they haven’t been that likable, rarely score, have a bad bullpen…maybe I’m the idiot.
slocs55 - June 29, 2009
Because it's a disease
It’s ok. It’s not your fault. . . .
Shanghai Badger - June 29, 2009
Who knows? It made no sense then and even less now!
But didn’t we get all these assurances from Hendry the Bradley is such a great guy in the clubhouse and he’s not a cancer and he’s really a high effort guy who gives 110%?? It was all total bullshit! Truth is, none of those things are true and the only reason he succeeded last year was that he was totally coddled by his Manager. The guy is a piece of sh*t!! Just ask Lou!!
Itchy - June 29, 2009
proof
that he was “coddled” by his manager last year?
Lou has apologized for the comment. Perhaps you should too.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
It's well known that Ron Washington insulated Milton from the press and controversy last year.
And I’m sure Lou was advised to appologize for the good of the organization and the $30 million bucks it wasted on this specimen.
Itchy - June 29, 2009
it is?
provide a cite.
Or maybe Lou apologized because he realized that his reaction was over the top.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
Ugh I am so distraght
This team stinks. I hope they get their head out of their asses and pull out some wins soon or I might write them off completely. This is terrible.
Sam Householder - June 29, 2009
Because I get so tired of the reactionary...
“Soriano Sucks! Bench him!” talk…
I thought I’d note that since June 18 (10 games, 49 PA, 45AB) , Soriano is batting .289/.347/.356/.702 (That’s AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS)
While it’s not enough data to make definitive conclusions, this is nonetheless a good sign. It’s very possible that he’s turning things around (regardless of a supposed injury). As well, someone already noted his UZR ratings in left, so I don’t need to mention them.
Bottom line is the statistics say Soriano is a good player. And trends might inspire hope that he is coming around batting-wise now.
I realize that this won’t matter to all the people who believe the only metric with which to measure a player is their all seeing perception of how hard he’s hustling. But I’m not sure it would be wise to bench someone when it appears they may start performing to your expectation levels…
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
it's because
he doesn’t DIVE, man.
It’s odd to see Soriano gradually improving. We’re very used to “augh crap! Wheee! Carry the team!” with him.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
They really should have...
a “# of dives per game” statistic. Maybe work an incentive clause into contracts, rewarding good dives. We can turn MLB into Mexican League soccer in no time.
(Apologies to Mexican League fans out there, but really…they take dives even more than the Italians do…and that says something.)
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
If that stat comes about, Edmonds and his agent will be on the phone trying to get back pay from Angels, Cards & Cubs.
ballhawk - June 29, 2009
I suppose I should've noted...
that my idea about a dive-stat was entirely tongue-in-cheek….
One of these days I’ll learn that fecetiousness doesn’t translate well to the internet.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
of course
you’d have to split it up between offensive dives and defensive dives. Diving to steal a base or score is WAY different than diving to catch a ball.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
as was mine.
your facetiousness factor is just fine
ballhawk - June 29, 2009
True, it's more like Soriano has some sort of on/off
switch where he is all or nothing for weeks on end either way.
Oh, and what is the ratio of D(ives)P(er)G(ame) to VOM?
N Oakley - June 29, 2009
Hmmmm. DPG/VOM. I’ll have to think on this one.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
How long has it been since he's homered? Seems like he had 14 HRs on about May 20th.
Itchy - June 29, 2009
That's true.
He hasn’t hit a HR since June 7th. While that’s surprising (and not exactly good for a player like him), it seems to me that he’s getting more and more solid contact. Yesterday for example, he very well could’ve been 3/4 if not for a line drive directly at the 3B.
He also has 3 doubles in his last 4 games, and multi-hit games in 5 of the last 10.
These aren’t leaps, but they’re positive steps.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
at one point, he was on pace to hit 162 HRs. Good times.
drewishdrewid - June 29, 2009
By my calculations...
That would’ve been some kind of record.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
LOL!
Itchy - June 29, 2009
A .702 OPS is not good.
jerry morales rules - June 29, 2009
I didn't say it was....
In and of itself. He’s not hitting for power, which obviously hurts his OPS. But that’s irrelevent. We’re analyzing the marginal difference between previous performance and current trends. From May 19th (approx when he really started to tale off) until June 17th (ie the day before my above referenced trend) his stat line was: .146/.214/.252./.467
A statline of .289/.347/.356/.702 is therefore a dramatic improvement.
My point is that while he still has a long way to go, recently he’s finally begun to hit the ball consistently and with greater slugging % (and at least from my perception, I’d say he’s hitting the ball more firmly.).
I assume you agree that that’s a good thing and a trend in the right direction.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
.356 is an awful slugging percentage
In fact, a slugging pct. of .252 with a batting average of .146 is more extra bases per at-bat than .356 with a BA of .289.
A .347 OBP is no great shakes for a leadoff hitter, but I’d take it from Soriano if he started actually hitting for power.
aldimond - June 29, 2009
Ugh...
I understand it’s not a good slugging percentage. I’m analyzing MARGINAL difference. Not absolute value.
As for
That’s true. So what? Is your suggestion that the best way for Soriano to come out of his slump is to get less hits, but have them be for extra bases? And exactly how would that help?
It would seem to me for a guy with a career of hitting extra bases, the best way to erase a slump is to restart the ability to get any hits at all (be they singles or whatever). Extra bases will eventually follow a more consistent ability to make contact for hits.
In other words, I’m analyzing based on what I see are indicators of future performance. (Perhaps your point?) and others is to simply say “I don’t like the result” regardless of acknowledging the marginal indicators of improvement and the prospects for a return to career-mean.
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
I get that it is a marginal improvement
But the argument has to take into account that he still has a ways to go. Is it moving in the right direction? Of course, but he hasn’t “righted the ship”. This argument would hold more water if we could get a baseline of recent performance that would be acceptable. While improving, his play is still unacceptable.
I don’t have the numbers in front of me, but I did read somewhere (probably on this site and maybe on this page) that Soto was hitting .286 since May 13. Now, that is an acceptable pace. Until Soriano can produce at an acceptable level, even for a few weeks, then we might have something to be encouraged about. Right now, it’s still crap.
jerry morales rules - June 30, 2009
In a similar vein to my post on Soriano above...
It’s worth repeating what other people have noted in other threads: Milton Bradley is definitely coming around.
From May 6th (which is the start date of his first consecutive game hit streak of the season; and really the first indication that he knew how to hit a baseball) until June 24th (I’m omitting this most recent White Sox series for now, to illustrate my point*):
Milton batted: .286/.384./.437/.821 (AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS). Clearly, he’s still lacking power. But it’s a definite improvement over his initial slow start. (From the beginning of the season until May 5th, when he was struggling mightily, his line was: .128/.305/.255/.560.)
What’s especially useful to keep in mind is that his stats are illustrative of how difficult it is to overcome the drag that a poor stat has on the appearance of your total season statistics. Despite the increased production from May 6th on, his season Batting Average has risen less than .90 points, for example. Which is my season-statistics aren’t really useful until later in the season.
*Before someone cries foul: If you include the recent White Sox series, where Milton had a rough go of it, his line from May 6th until today is: .276/.370/.417/.787. I would speculate that that was simply just a rought series and not indicative of his current upward trend; hence my omitting it above.)
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
*why....
“Which is why season-statistics aren’t really useful” that should read. D’oh!
CubsWin!Oregon - June 29, 2009
Zero power and 8th on the team in RBIs is a joke.
Add in his terrible defense and temper tantrums, and Bradley has had a major negative influence on this ballclub. He’s had many opportunities to produce in the clutch and failed miserably. Most recent example, yesterday, 3-0 game, 1 out, man on 3rd, what’s he do? Strike out.
Itchy - June 29, 2009
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