Good night…I need to work tomorrow. Why do I even stay up late to watch Marmol and Gregg..?? Adios….Another game lost to the freakin Padres in the bottom of the 9th..
Thank you Kevin Gregg…the homerun king of Chicago!!!
Outside of Miles, they have indeed played to “acceptable levels.” Not quite to career norms, but certainly not horrific. And in all fairness, they didn’t get to choose their respective salaries.
I appreciate your insult though, misguided as it may be.
If we'd been willing to trade prospects in the past, we'd be infinitely better off.
You know, when the Pirates were selling the farm, someone got Jason Bay. Someone got Nate McLouth. Someone got Nyjer Morgan.
We got Grabow and Gorz. Not terrible…. but considering that Hendry only does one thing well – trading with Pittsburgh – I would have liked to have gone for the brass ring.
Of course, Hendry held on to Hill and Pie like grim death…. until he got distracted by the next shiny object and moved them all as pawns in his grand scheme to add Aaron Heilman.
What I’m saying is that you occasionally have to part with a prospect who your scouts like, in order to land superstar MLB players.
Take Detroit, for instance. They traded Maybin and Miller for Miggy Cabrera – I don’t think they’re particularly upset about it. Even Boston, trading Hanley for Beckett — you have to give something to get something.
The Cubs would rather make deals around the margins, and try to get “serviceable” players to fill the gaps.
that it is more of an indictment of the scouting department (as well as the input of both Lou and JH) rather than a reluctance to trade talent. There have been a few exceptions to that trend (Hill to PITT) and Rich Hill did have one quality year.
there's always a chance he isn't as good as advertised
if you can get a piece to win right now, I don’t see why you wouldn’t make the deal. Remember when Hendry refused to put Pie in a Roberts deal. This is the kind of thing I’m talking about. Trade for proven guys.
I remember Angelos vetoing some deal. Also to be fair there is no indication the Cubs ever had any serious talks with the Padres about Bell, they did discuss including Vitters in a deal for Peavy but the Padres seemed more interested in pitching.
And “pretty well” is exactly what he’s done. He had some torrid streaks in the midwest league, and he’s flat-out sucked in Daytona.
All in all, his Midwest league stats are the first time that we could say “that’s the kind of performance I’d hoped for”, and even then it wasn’t overwhelming – he’s more or less on par with what Kyler Burke has posted for the same Peoria team.
And no one would be crying if we traded Kyler in a deal for Peavy or Bell.
What, ah, what do you want me to say? We have some guys that go out there, and, ah, they have to play the game, and, uh, if they don’t execute…Look, we’re just going to come back and do this thing tomorrow.
Tired arm, tired bat whatever. Blanco who had a homer in Iowa tonight and Berg or Stevens can come back and
Guzman can be the closer. Lou can sit in the dugout as long as Trammell makes all the calls.
Still 6 weeks left.
Bradley struck out with the insurance run on base and Gregg decided to pitch behind every hitter (except González) and give up the game to the worse team in the West.
Lou was so out of the loop that he made a visit to the 3rd base line to order an intentional walk.
Don’t use Sam Fuld as a pinch-hitter, or if you do, immediately insert him into left field to play defense.
Play Koyie Hill more than once a week. There’s a reason the club is something like 10 games over .500 when he starts.
Put Aaron Miles at the far end of the bench and use him only as a pinch-hitter after all starting pitchers have already been used to pinch-hit.
Flip the roles of Kevin Gregg and Angel Guzman.
That’s just what I would do if I was managing the Cubs.
Clearly it’s just common sense, but how can Lou/Jim/anybody else in the Cubs front office not see that?
to predict the performance of individual players, but anyone telling you they thought the Cubs would play like they have as a unit is, like I said above, lying.
all due respect, but there were people here and there
who were dumbfounded by the moves Hendry made, and wondered if we didn’t actually downgrade. Of course that sounds like hindsight now, and I can’t say “I called it” but I was uneasy with the makeup of this team, and certainly wondered if this might happen
Flame if you will, but we sorely miss the veteran leadership of Edmonds, Wood, and DeRosa this year. The most maddening thing is that we’ll most likely see the same team, with maybe a few minor tweaks, on the field next year.
That applies to "chemistry". "Leadership" is different.
I don’t think that you need to have a bunch of guys who get along to win.
However, I think that a team comprised entirely of “followers” and complementary players will fail, every time. You need alpha personalities to galvanize a team to win in team sports.
Did you ever notice that a lack of real quality exists throughout the Tribune company?
Listen to the people they have on the radio. Look at the people they have let go from the newspaper and have kept. Listen to Pat and Ron. Whatever product the company puts out is overall mediocre. We see the same results on the ballfield. I think it must be some kind of corporate philosophy. I have been waiting for an ownership change for years. I can’t wait for it to finally happen. Maybe someone else will come in and try for quality. Maybe you didn’t mean that when you wrote your comment, but I think it applies to the whole corporation, Cubs included.
THERES LOTS OF TIME LEFT AND SORIANO AND CAREER NORMS
Seriously, I agree with a lot of that.
These guys are not very good at baseball. I mean, compared to other MLB players, and especially compared to other MLB players making 8 figures annually.
Maybe some good will come from this failed 2009 season.
Maybe Jim Hendry’s failure will cause the organization to reevaluate it’s “OBP is for weiners” philosophy. Maybe the new guy will say "Wait a minute. Perhaps these nerds are right. Perhaps I’ve been wrong to blindly folow the traditions and superstitions of past centuries. Maybe we GMs should test these assumptions analytically, through experimentation, studies of empirical results of the last 100 years of baseball, and a “scientific method”. Maybe this scientific method could be extended to other fields of learning: the natural sciences, art, architecture, navigation. Perhaps I could lead the way to a new age, an age of rebirth, a Cubbie Renaissance!"
First off, that post is, word for word, from Steve Martin’s “Theodoric of York, Medieval Barber” SNL sketch. For crying out loud.
Secondly, “one of the best GMs in the game”. Seriously? An argument can be made that he is not in the bottom 5… I suppose…. but how can you explain $130+M for this offense? For this roster?
Hendry is going to be fired at the end of this year, and deservedly so. The Cubs will have to spend the next 5 years paying for his mistakes. His era is over, but the hangover is going to SUCK.
For instance, I think he would have been run out of New York or Boston on a rail.
I think that, once again, it gets back to what the fanbase is willing to accept. If you posit that we should be happy with winning the central on occasion and hoping to get lucky in the playoffs, then sure, Hendry has done what is necessary. It helps that the playing field is uneven, and he can outspend his competition by a factor of 5, but that’s neither here nor there.
If the goal is to build a winning organization, Hendry has failed rather spectacularly. The series of free agent busts Hendry has fallen into have resulted in relatively weak 25-man rosters throughout Hendry’s tenure (relative to his peers in payroll), and will seriously hamstring Hendry’s successor over the next 5 years.
Now, when Gregg blew the save the last game in Florida, I did blame Lou for that. Gregg had just thrown 40-something pitches the night before. He didn’t need to come in.
Tonight? Yeah, Gregg was the main culprit. But drive in a few of those runs earlier and that ninth inning probably plays out differently.
Well I think playing Fonty over Baker was pretty bad. I don’t think he had a lot of choice with Miles since Theriot is not available but
Gregg is your closer and that is who you use. Had he gotten the third F*^%$$ing out when he was supposed to we would not be having this discussion so yes poor line up construction is on Lou, acting like a zoned out old man is on Lou but using Gregg is not his fault
UNLESS he does it again .
…and let their teams perform in the last 6 NL Central races, and you’ll see 3 division titles.
Hopefully, said poster won’t puss out on the Carlos Beltran pursuit, and then overcompensate by giving Alfonso Soriano $138 million dollars for his age 31-38 seasons.
Honestly, a great deal of Hendry’s moves seem to have been made on blind faith. Like the naked assumption that Alfonso Soriano could play CF, because he “looks like” he could be a centerfielder. Or the assumption that Kevin Gregg could be an effective closer, because after all, he had 29 saves once.
His first year with the Mets was mediocre. He had those leg issues.
Since then, OPS+ of 150, 126, 129, and 150. That’s spectacular by any standard. A few more years like that and you start calling someone a Hall of Famer.
Heck, a few 150 OPS+ years can get a corner OF into the Hall. For a CF, it’s even more rare.
How quickly you forget - The Mets made the NLCS in 2006.
And Beltran was pretty valiant in that series loss to the Cardinals, with an OPS over 1.000.
Beltran is objectively better than Alfonso Soriano at every single skill in baseball. He is a better contact hitter, a better power hitter, a dramatically better fielder at a more valuable position, and a better baserunner.
What, pray tell, is my “standard” for GM performance? I wasn’t aware that I’d set one. I certainly wouldn’t base it entirely upon winning playoff series.
In 06, the mets lost game 7 of the nlcs. The Cubs were horrific.
In 07 and 08, the cubs got swept out of the nlds, while th mets got edged out by the phils. In 07, the cubs were helped by winning a terrible division.
This year, the mets lost essentially every player on their team. And, in all likelihood, both teams will miss the playoffs.
In the last 4 years, it’s advantage mets. Even with the playoff misses in 07-08. It’s cold comfort to point to our zero playoff wins as evidence of superiority.
all the Cubs’ injuries this year are some hallucination I’m having? If you’re going to excuse the Mets for their injuries, than you’ve got to excuse the Cubs for theirs, too.
Last thing before i hit the hay, if this team continues to suck
Hendry and Lou are gone. I’m more certain about Hendry but Lou looks lackadaisical. I can’t wait until this team wins but there’s a part of me that is excited to see a new team with new possible owner.
All Lou will be remembered for when he is gone is failing in the postseason
Division titles mean nothing when you have gone 101 years without a championship, but with all the awful contracts Hendry has given out we wont be contending for a championship for another 3-4 years
The season is near over, it's a little too late. Actually, way too late.
Gregg has been shaky since day one and other options should’ve been explored months agoincludinga closer by committee, egos be dammed. lou has stuck to the Marol in the 8th, Gregg in the 9th formula way too long.
oops, I missed a couple spaces there, other options should’ve been explored months ago including a closer by committee, egos be dammed. lou has stuck to the Marol in the 8th, Gregg in the 9th formula way too long.
I’ll preface this by saying that, with few exceptions, most relievers can perform adequately in the 9th. Billy Beane learned this, and spent half a decade creating “closers” from thin air and then trading them for legitimate assets.
That being said – 23/29 in save opportunities, the most HR allowed for all closers, 28 ER in 56 IP.
There just really isn’t a lot to point to as evidence of him being “fine”, even prior to the FLA series.
Especially with the gutpunch losses he’s endured this year. The Astros meltdown. The Tigers walkoff. It’s pretty much been a big bag of hurt all year.
Most knowledgeable baseball fans knew Gregg was not of closer quality before this year, let alone closer material for a team expecting to contend for a world series after 101 years without a championship, we would have been better off with Kerry this year
And that is nowhere near acceptable for a team that is supposed to be contending for a championship, if this team somehow manages to pull something out of their ass and make the playoffs there is no team out there that would be intimidated of that bum coming out onto the mound at any time
I think it’s six of one, half-a-dozen of the other. What, Wood has some sort of Cubbie Sixth Sense that would make him better suited to be closer here? Now you’re really getting out there.
It was bad enough having to listen to it, let alone watch it.
Interesting two days. Yesterday the Padres closer can’t get the save against the Cardinals, and tonight the Padres win a game the exact same way. If you’re looking at it dispassionately, I guess that’s another example of why baseball is a great game
Two rows behind me were Padres fans, one of whom was wearing a “Cubs suck” t-shirt. During the ninth inning, they were trying to provoke me … I ignored them as much as I could.
spit up my Cheerio-s. :) STL does have a big inferiority complex, too.
Funny, when the Cubs were on their big run last season, razzing Cardinals fans was the last thing on my mind. Now, it seems Cardinals fans have nothing better to do than razz Cubs fans. Pathetic.
letting Wood go, sure I understand how that would set some folks off (and it did). But I don’t see how signing Hoffman would have been greeted with jeers and howls.
Sure, at the time, a case could have been made that Hoffman might be past his prime – I seem to recall him getting knocked around pretty good a few times last year when he was still with the Padres. But the guy’s a sure-fire HOFer and the all-time saves leader. Something to be said for having that pedigree on your staff. Worse case scenario – again, at the time – would have been yeah, he doesn’t quite have it anymore but he can help groom Marmol.
I insist, NBF, that to me, the season ended a week ago in Denver. However, I commend you for keeping the faith. I just won’t lose more time watching these chokers at such a late hour. At least I used up some time to pay off some bills while the suckers “played”.
CUBS WIN THREAD!
Ron Trauma - August 17, 2009
haha
jxmetal1 - August 17, 2009
fail.
vtcub - August 17, 2009
Ron Trauma - August 18, 2009
Is the Teflon...
….starting to wear off?
MPH73 - August 18, 2009
Ron Trauma - August 18, 2009
Ron Trauma - August 18, 2009
Thanks, Gregg.
dtpollitt - August 17, 2009
Kevin Gregg, there's not enough hate in this world.
dtpollitt - August 17, 2009
Can I kick him in the nuts?
sue369 - August 17, 2009
Only after I get to
Hilary Lee - August 18, 2009
deal
sue369 - August 18, 2009
well that's just great.
sue369 - August 17, 2009
Good night…I need to work tomorrow. Why do I even stay up late to watch Marmol and Gregg..?? Adios….Another game lost to the freakin Padres in the bottom of the 9th..
Thank you Kevin Gregg…the homerun king of Chicago!!!
mmancubfan - August 17, 2009
Kevin Gregg, You're a stupid asshole.
why are we still running Gregg out there? someone please remind me.
lumberjack7 - August 17, 2009
The Same Old Reason
We Run Miles and Fontenot out there.
garyscottrules - August 17, 2009
6 out...
Goodbye 2009.
CubsBullsBears - August 17, 2009
Not quite
but … that was huge.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 17, 2009
yep, game 1 of a tough road trip. Very disappointing and sad loss
I hope not that this is the final nail on the 2009 coffin
cubsnlinux - August 17, 2009
Well ...
No way to spin that.
What an awful, awful loss.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 17, 2009
If Bruce is downtrodden, well...
…it’s a bad loss.
dtpollitt - August 17, 2009
That does it
CUBS ARE DONE.
cubfanwill - August 17, 2009
Some of us have been saying that
Ace Venom - August 17, 2009
DFA Kevin Gregg
Ace Venom - August 17, 2009
OHHHHHHHHHHHHH
THIS THREAD IS FILLED WITH THE TEARS OF EMPTY HOPES AND SADNESS
Craig in South Bend - August 17, 2009
every BCB thread ever is that
CubsFanInWisconsin - August 17, 2009
I was being facetious
Craig in South Bend - August 17, 2009
I miss KW
CubsFanInWisconsin - August 17, 2009
He blew
his fair share of saves, too, and he’s not good at all this season.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 17, 2009
true, but at least he showed some heart out there. Gregg doesn’t look like he gives a shit if they win or lose.
lumberjack7 - August 18, 2009
I'm sure Gregg cares
perhaps too much.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I don't give a rat's ass what Gregg is feeling right now
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
He does. He's just not a good closer.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
How many saves did he blow with the Cubs?
D98 - August 18, 2009
How far back in the WC are we?
Kansas25 - August 17, 2009
Who cares?
Wait until next year.
Ace Venom - August 17, 2009
I do.
If you don’t, move on.
Kansas25 - August 17, 2009
Well put
Not Bruce Froemming - August 17, 2009
I waited for you to post. Just something to make me at least think that the remaining 46 are worth talking about
louslovechild - August 18, 2009
In this for the long haul
I’m no bandwagon fan. I’m just a very realistic one.
Ace Venom - August 17, 2009
If you aren't embarrassed for these guys, you aren't paying attention.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Is it difficult to interpret...
“how many games back are we in the WC?”
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
We are deep in the W.C.
eths - August 18, 2009
Four games
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
W.C. = European abbreviation for water closet
But 4 games down on the wild card does sound doable, if this team finally gets their act together.
eths - August 18, 2009
I will worry about that
when this team starts playing something that resembles baseball
bheidge - August 17, 2009
I didn't ask...
if you cared about the wc.
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
4.0
Hilary Lee - August 18, 2009
Thanks.
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
This team is bad
bheidge - August 17, 2009
throw Gregg and Miles in the bottom of the fucking ocean
DC Cubbie - August 17, 2009
heilman wants to join
CubsFanInWisconsin - August 17, 2009
couldn’t put it any better myself
lumberjack7 - August 17, 2009
Man, oh man.
08Cubs - August 17, 2009
LOOK AT THIS EVERYBODY:
GREGG’S STATLINE: 2 BB 2 H 4 R 4 ER 1 HR 0.2 IP
dtpollitt - August 17, 2009
That's redonkulous
Just outstanding.
Craig in South Bend - August 17, 2009
I need to get that worthless fuck off my fantasy team
bheidge - August 17, 2009
I wish that a Cubs fan in San Diego would have thrown their beer on Gregg after this game
IowaCubsWS09 - August 18, 2009
an expensive joke
that’s all this team is
John T. Unger - August 17, 2009
i would rather have joe borowski
even he made me feel more confident watching him close out games
mycubs1987 - August 17, 2009
http://www.bleedcubbieblue.com/2009/8/11/986167/come-here-and-vent
jesus christos - August 17, 2009
haven't hated a cubs pitcher this much since
latroy hawkins during the last week of the 2004 season
mycubs1987 - August 17, 2009
I seem to remember a certain lefty that I hated more
He started for the Cubs for a little while…. I can’t remember his name off the top of my head but he had like a 10 ERA
IowaCubsWS09 - August 18, 2009
I don't think
even the staunchest of Cubs hopeful can see anything positive after tonight’s game
CubsFan87 - August 17, 2009
Ted Lilly...
returning from the DL with 6 shutout innings. Marmol with zero walks.
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
No one was injured
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
dont jinx it...
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
Might as well...
Just shelf Ramirez and have him get the shoulder surgery ASAP so he’ll be ready for ST next year.
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
Where ever you send Gregg...
… I’ll be glad to send Scott Linebrink as well.
DrCrawdad - August 18, 2009
If Cubs and Sox fans unite
I’m sure we can find somewhere to send our pieces of crap…
Hilary Lee - August 18, 2009
Exactly!
Linebrink was staked to a 3 run lead. Gets 2 outs then walks the next two batters then serves up a mamoth blast, nearly to the concourse in RF.
Sometimes these games work out exactly as us pessimists think it will.
DrCrawdad - August 18, 2009
That sounds eerily familiar....
Hilary Lee - August 18, 2009
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
IIRC
The Sox have Linebrink under contract another year on the other hand I believe Gregg is gone.
DrCrawdad - August 18, 2009
Absolutely pathetic
cubfanwill - August 18, 2009
what about one run scored?
the offense is also at fault.
John T. Unger - August 18, 2009
its a closers fucking job to save leads
CubsFanInWisconsin - August 18, 2009
it was a one run lead 0 -1 is the same as 2 -1 and 3 -2, 4-3 etc
CubsFanInWisconsin - August 18, 2009
1 run off Kevin Correra? I don't even know how to spell his name. All I know is that he sucks and the Cubs scored 1 runnnnnnnnnnn
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
ok how many do you think would have scored? more than 4?
CubsFanInWisconsin - August 18, 2009
we stranded 10, so yes, it's a possibility
This team, top to bottom, is bad.
Illicat - August 18, 2009
As much as I hate Gregg right now...
We scored 1 freakin’ run. More blown scoring opportunities, more suck of Miles and Fontenot at the plate, Geo is really bad right now…
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
Could Geo just not be doing steroids anymore?
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
He's just overweight and out of shape...
He let the ROY go to his head, and didn’t put in the work this offseason.
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
we should all send Aaron Miles steriods
he’ll play a bit better until he gets suspended
shake n bake - August 18, 2009
+1
IowaCubsWS09 - August 18, 2009
He'd even find a way to screw that up
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
The aggravating part
is that the Padres’ most feared hitter, Gonzalez, was an easy out.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
No...
It was walking David Freaking Eckstein.
cubfanwill - August 18, 2009
Bingo
Eckstein couldn’t have hit a HR tonight with two swings.
ElHijoDelRonSanto - August 18, 2009
agreed
but walking eckstein is obviously the most unacceptable part of all of this…he’s the padres’ own aaron miles
mycubs1987 - August 18, 2009
but aaron miles doesn't even get walks
DC Cubbie - August 18, 2009
Well, quite true
You can’t walk someone, particularly him, in that situation. Serve up the ball on a tee if you must.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Gregg is the latest in a line of shitty closer pickups
Dave Smith, Mel Rojas, Latroy Hawkins… all garbage.
ElHijoDelRonSanto - August 18, 2009
And our hot hand the Muffin Man
sat on the freakin’ bench.
sue369 - August 18, 2009
yeah I'm gald we saved him, how many did the craptastic double play duo leave on base today?
DC Cubbie - August 18, 2009
That's why I remarked earlier that Lou looked like he wanted these kids off his lawn
He seriously looked like he didn’t have a clue.
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
lol i liked how gregg went off the field and went straight down the tunnel. You suck so much.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
No, he's pretty good.
Good at fucking sucking.
dtpollitt - August 18, 2009
He and Ryan Braun should go bowling.
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
hi-o
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
hopefully to floss with a 12gauge.
lumberjack7 - August 18, 2009
Enough
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
pretty stupid comment.
sue369 - August 18, 2009
Oh look...
Heath Bell gets the win, after screwing up yesterday to the Cards.
STICK A FORK IN THIS TEAM. THEY ARE DONE.
cubfanwill - August 18, 2009
A lot has to be done to make this team a contender in 2010
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
Well, for one thing,
the current players need to play up to their career averages.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
A lot of them need to be given the opportunity to do it
elsewhere.
ElHijoDelRonSanto - August 18, 2009
And replaced
by whom? If you’re going to say “Get rid of a lot of them,” you’d better have some alternatives.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Fuld, Fox, Scales, Blanco, Guzman, Stevens, etc.
I don’t care if the 2010 team doesn’t win the division, I don’t want these overpaid assholes back at Wrigley stealing money.
ElHijoDelRonSanto - August 18, 2009
Yeah!
People who make a lot of money suck! They should never fail!
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
If you think Bradley, Soriano, Miles, Gregg, etc.
have even come close to performing at an acceptable MLB level — regardless of their inflated income — then you obviously have shit for brains.
ElHijoDelRonSanto - August 18, 2009
I'll chalk this up to being upset
but you make about as much sense as my 3-year-old nephew right now.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
OK
just don’t refute anything I said.
ElHijoDelRonSanto - August 18, 2009
I refute all of it
Upon further reflection, my nephew might make MORE sense.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Your nephew can't be much worse than Kevin Gregg right now.
cubfanwill - August 18, 2009
Actually
I think my nephew has a better slider.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Jealousy is a foul stench, to be sure.
Outside of Miles, they have indeed played to “acceptable levels.” Not quite to career norms, but certainly not horrific. And in all fairness, they didn’t get to choose their respective salaries.
I appreciate your insult though, misguided as it may be.
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
SORIANO?!
That isn’t even close to acceptable. Not even for a MLB-minimum type of player, on a team that fancies itself a contender.
Gregg? Really?
D98 - August 18, 2009
"And in all fairness, they didn’t get to choose their respective salaries."
I call bullshit
Illicat - August 18, 2009
Gregg will be gone and I suspect Miles will be as well
But Soriano and Bradley are here to stay so get used to it.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
Soriano and Bradley aren't even the biggest problems this year
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
Only way this team gets better is if Hendry and Lou are gone
Illicat - August 18, 2009
Well, there's a lot of blame to go around
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
I will put most of this on Gregg
hes the one with the BS and the L
bheidge - August 18, 2009
Screw the current players!
Especially Milton Bradley, he’s a piece of shit
Itchy - August 18, 2009
Oh for God's sake.
Seriously?
D98 - August 18, 2009
Bad contracts and no money...
Equal not many significant changes.
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
Hendry's contracts absolutely tie the next GM's hands.
They have to eat a TON of contracts this offseason. Starting with Soriano. It may take a year of sucking to work this through the system.
D98 - August 18, 2009
No, not done
But this certainly doesn’t help matters.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I'll take he is on my fantasy team
trust me I would rather not have it, but I’ll take anything to help me sleep tonight
DC Cubbie - August 18, 2009
i would have traded vitters for heath bell....
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
Wait. Wat.
dtpollitt - August 18, 2009
padres wanted vitters in a package for bell
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
Would have been worth it
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
damn right.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
damn stupid.
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
Kevin Gregg.
Yep!
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
If we'd been willing to trade prospects in the past, we'd be infinitely better off.
You know, when the Pirates were selling the farm, someone got Jason Bay. Someone got Nate McLouth. Someone got Nyjer Morgan.
We got Grabow and Gorz. Not terrible…. but considering that Hendry only does one thing well – trading with Pittsburgh – I would have liked to have gone for the brass ring.
Of course, Hendry held on to Hill and Pie like grim death…. until he got distracted by the next shiny object and moved them all as pawns in his grand scheme to add Aaron Heilman.
D98 - August 18, 2009
I would say...
that each player should be assessed differently. Many players never do find success, but there are also those who turn into quality players.
Failed scouting reports or whatever led to the disastrous decision to keep Pie so long shouldn’t really determine how we handle a different player.
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
Well, yeah. Those are truisms.
What I’m saying is that you occasionally have to part with a prospect who your scouts like, in order to land superstar MLB players.
Take Detroit, for instance. They traded Maybin and Miller for Miggy Cabrera – I don’t think they’re particularly upset about it. Even Boston, trading Hanley for Beckett — you have to give something to get something.
The Cubs would rather make deals around the margins, and try to get “serviceable” players to fill the gaps.
D98 - August 18, 2009
I would tend to think...
that it is more of an indictment of the scouting department (as well as the input of both Lou and JH) rather than a reluctance to trade talent. There have been a few exceptions to that trend (Hill to PITT) and Rich Hill did have one quality year.
Kansas25 - August 18, 2009
Did the package include Guzman , Wells & Marshall ?
Padres were not trading Bell for Vitters so don’t cry over it.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
i don't think Guzman or Wells was in the deal.
If it was marshall, vitters, and other players then good right ahead.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
Trust me Padres wanted a lot more than Vitters for Bell
I believe he has two more years under team control. Several teams tried for him and none succeeded.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
yeah they wanted more.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
He's 31 already and this is his 1st year as a closer
bheidge - August 18, 2009
Just a guess here but I think somebody named Trevor Hoffman had something to do with that...
ballhawk - August 18, 2009
I dunno
he played 3 years with the Mets in his 26-28 year seasons and absolutely stunk the place up
bheidge - August 18, 2009
yabbut, he's pretty much been lights out the last three years with Padres
ballhawk - August 18, 2009
Petco might have something to do with that
Illicat - August 18, 2009
You want to trade a guy that's thrown <300 innings in his career as a closer and has 31 saves to show for it for our #1 minor leaguer?
dtpollitt - August 18, 2009
I would have been pissed if
that trade was made
bheidge - August 18, 2009
lol number 1 minor leaguer.
felix pie, donald veal, tyler colvin, etc. …. what have they really turned out to be?
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
I get what your saying
but none of those guys really have anything to do with Vitters
bheidge - August 18, 2009
there's always a chance he isn't as good as advertised
if you can get a piece to win right now, I don’t see why you wouldn’t make the deal. Remember when Hendry refused to put Pie in a Roberts deal. This is the kind of thing I’m talking about. Trade for proven guys.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
Thanks for reminding me of another reason why Hendry must leave.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
And ironically
The Os got him anyway
Hilary Lee - August 18, 2009
That was because we NEEDED Aaron Heilman.
It took like 5 transactions to get the pieces in place to land Aaron Heilman.
WHat happened last offseason?!
D98 - August 18, 2009
Actually I don't remember this
I remember Angelos vetoing some deal. Also to be fair there is no indication the Cubs ever had any serious talks with the Padres about Bell, they did discuss including Vitters in a deal for Peavy but the Padres seemed more interested in pitching.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
idk. him refusing and the cubs not making a better offer
link
or this link
funny looking back at it because i would trade any one of those proposed players for Roberts.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
oh and phil rogers
i hate you
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
Same old speculation though
Roberts is an Angelos pet and I don’t think he was gonna be traded.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
if the package was good, roberts would be a cub
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
As I recall, the only way the O’s would trade Roberts to ANY team
is if they clearly “won” the trade, a.k.a. “robbed” the other team.
The foolish deal the Mariners made with the O’s for Bedard encouraged this strategy.
cowsarecool220 - August 18, 2009
at that time, the O's would have robbed the Cubs
with Pie, Hill, Colvin, Cedeno. When i look back at it, i just want to stab myself.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
I'd like to see Vitters do better at high-A ball.
Honestly, I’m starting to get a bit concerned with our offensive players falling on their faces every time they’re promoted.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Vitter is, what, 19 years old?
It’s a little early to be concerned.
Overall, I think he’s done pretty well in the minors. It’ll be years before we’ll know if he’s the real deal.
cowsarecool220 - August 18, 2009
Yes - he'll be 20 in 10 days.
And “pretty well” is exactly what he’s done. He had some torrid streaks in the midwest league, and he’s flat-out sucked in Daytona.
All in all, his Midwest league stats are the first time that we could say “that’s the kind of performance I’d hoped for”, and even then it wasn’t overwhelming – he’s more or less on par with what Kyler Burke has posted for the same Peoria team.
And no one would be crying if we traded Kyler in a deal for Peavy or Bell.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Any chance we get to hear a post game interview...
With Lou?
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
Hopefully he says, "I quit."
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
and miles will quit too
also jim hendry. wait im dreaming again
CubsFanInWisconsin - August 18, 2009
I'll play this dream game too
Mmm….beeeeeeer.
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
hopefully he comes out covered in blood holding Gregg's right arm
and yes I am kidding
DC Cubbie - August 18, 2009
I LOL'd
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
Well, ah, we have to execute...I don't know...
What, ah, what do you want me to say? We have some guys that go out there, and, ah, they have to play the game, and, uh, if they don’t execute…Look, we’re just going to come back and do this thing tomorrow.
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
That's pretty much it
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
That's ALWAYS it
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
Gregg and Miles need to get some kind of injury
Tired arm, tired bat whatever. Blanco who had a homer in Iowa tonight and Berg or Stevens can come back and
Guzman can be the closer. Lou can sit in the dugout as long as Trammell makes all the calls.
Still 6 weeks left.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
Girl has a point
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
I feel like...
been awake for about 30 minutes now and already today sucks.
eths - August 18, 2009
so that’s what aaron miles looks like out of uniform.
lumberjack7 - August 18, 2009
Gregg's brain?
eths - August 18, 2009
Looks more like Chet from Weird Science.
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
Pathetic 9th
Bradley struck out with the insurance run on base and Gregg decided to pitch behind every hitter (except González) and give up the game to the worse team in the West.
Lou was so out of the loop that he made a visit to the 3rd base line to order an intentional walk.
Hendry, this is the team you made up. Pathetic.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
I think Lou went out there to kill Gregg
then realized there were about 20,000 witnesses
DC Cubbie - August 18, 2009
Ha, ha!
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
Lou, here is your lineup, use it
1. Fukudome, cf
2. Bradley, rf
3. Lee, 1b
4. Ramirez, 3b
5. Soto, c
6. Soriano, lf
7. Baker, 2b
8. Theriot, ss
9. Pitcher
Don’t use Sam Fuld as a pinch-hitter, or if you do, immediately insert him into left field to play defense.
Play Koyie Hill more than once a week. There’s a reason the club is something like 10 games over .500 when he starts.
Put Aaron Miles at the far end of the bench and use him only as a pinch-hitter after all starting pitchers have already been used to pinch-hit.
Flip the roles of Kevin Gregg and Angel Guzman.
That’s just what I would do if I was managing the Cubs.
Clearly it’s just common sense, but how can Lou/Jim/anybody else in the Cubs front office not see that?
burncruisin - August 18, 2009
soto batting 5th
what
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
either him or baker
i don’t think i would put soriano there
burncruisin - August 18, 2009
This sucks...
Not only is it late, but I’m wired now and can’t fall asleep.
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
I am taking a sleeping pill
I hope one is enough
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
I was about to do the same
I woke up and watched the end of this, and now I have to try and get back to sleep…Wonderful.
Craig in South Bend - August 18, 2009
great. i love hearing people on the radio tell me how they predicted the cubs to be this bad and other stupid shit
can this team just start to play?
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
Blou has his own Radio Show ?
or was he just calling in.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
nope les grobstein .... intelligent but annoying as hell
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
If anyone actually says
That they predicted this in the beginning of the season, they are lying. I’d demand proof before I believed them.
Hilary Lee - August 18, 2009
lol he was like .... i picked them to finish in 2nd from the beginning of the year ... i was right when i said St louis would be first
all this bullshit
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
That made me rage
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
I predicted
Gregg would be mediocre, Heilmann would suck and Miles is garbage. But these arent much of predictions, more of well known and documented facts
bheidge - August 18, 2009
It's one thing
to predict the performance of individual players, but anyone telling you they thought the Cubs would play like they have as a unit is, like I said above, lying.
Hilary Lee - August 18, 2009
I figured they would take the division
but the Cardinals didnt have the team then that they have now
bheidge - August 18, 2009
Do yourselves a favor
and don’t listen to postgame radio shows. The dumbest, most clueless poster here looks like Einstein compared to those idiots.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
These are the same people that proclaim
Kaplan as the “most knowledgeable baseball person.”
As always, consider the source.
cowsarecool220 - August 18, 2009
LOL - at first glance, I thought you had typed "Eckstein"
ballhawk - August 18, 2009
Freudian slip?
I think that’s what Gregg had when he walked him …
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I think my posting history is still publicly posted here --
This team was horrifically designed, and we’re seeing the natural outcome of Hendry’s horrendous 2008 offseason.
D98 - August 18, 2009
all due respect, but there were people here and there
who were dumbfounded by the moves Hendry made, and wondered if we didn’t actually downgrade. Of course that sounds like hindsight now, and I can’t say “I called it” but I was uneasy with the makeup of this team, and certainly wondered if this might happen
Illicat - August 18, 2009
Is Miles a spy that La Russa sent to sink our season? :)
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
he's still on their payroll for sure
IowaCubsWS09 - August 18, 2009
JUST LIKE THE TITANIC....
Started to make a slide towards the bottom. It now looks like the 2009 Cubs are also doomed .
cubs north - August 18, 2009
Yes they are
This team is a giant pile of crap
Itchy - August 18, 2009
Oh my God I'm so glad I didn't get to see this
Lou cannot possibly trot Gregg out there again can he?
And this team is just not good when Miles is in the lineup.
Mapmaker - August 18, 2009
HE CAN AND HE WILL.....
Gregg will continue to close . Just feel sorry for all the Cub fans that paid so much to see this game .
cubs north - August 18, 2009
maybe my player from mlb 09 the show could be the closer
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
This team has no leadership or identity...
Flame if you will, but we sorely miss the veteran leadership of Edmonds, Wood, and DeRosa this year. The most maddening thing is that we’ll most likely see the same team, with maybe a few minor tweaks, on the field next year.
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
Doesn't matter
“Leadership” is overrated. Winning provides it. Losing doesn’t.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
That applies to "chemistry". "Leadership" is different.
I don’t think that you need to have a bunch of guys who get along to win.
However, I think that a team comprised entirely of “followers” and complementary players will fail, every time. You need alpha personalities to galvanize a team to win in team sports.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Whether it's business or baseball...
Successful teams and organizations have great leaders within their management on on the front lines. This team as constructed doesn’t have that.
CubsBullsBears - August 18, 2009
Did you ever notice that a lack of real quality exists throughout the Tribune company?
Listen to the people they have on the radio. Look at the people they have let go from the newspaper and have kept. Listen to Pat and Ron. Whatever product the company puts out is overall mediocre. We see the same results on the ballfield. I think it must be some kind of corporate philosophy. I have been waiting for an ownership change for years. I can’t wait for it to finally happen. Maybe someone else will come in and try for quality. Maybe you didn’t mean that when you wrote your comment, but I think it applies to the whole corporation, Cubs included.
mattvegas - August 18, 2009
AND DON'T FORGET ....
Lou and his coaching staff also,,,,
cubs north - August 18, 2009
THERES LOTS OF TIME LEFT AND SORIANO AND CAREER NORMS
Seriously, I agree with a lot of that.
These guys are not very good at baseball. I mean, compared to other MLB players, and especially compared to other MLB players making 8 figures annually.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Fuck this season
I’m ready for football
TuscaniLove - August 18, 2009
I'll be going to plenty of LSU games
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
Im done. Bring me this man's head on a Silver Platter.
Ron Trauma - August 18, 2009
Maybe some good will come from this failed 2009 season.
Maybe Jim Hendry’s failure will cause the organization to reevaluate it’s “OBP is for weiners” philosophy. Maybe the new guy will say "Wait a minute. Perhaps these nerds are right. Perhaps I’ve been wrong to blindly folow the traditions and superstitions of past centuries. Maybe we GMs should test these assumptions analytically, through experimentation, studies of empirical results of the last 100 years of baseball, and a “scientific method”. Maybe this scientific method could be extended to other fields of learning: the natural sciences, art, architecture, navigation. Perhaps I could lead the way to a new age, an age of rebirth, a Cubbie Renaissance!"
[ thinks for a minute ]
“Naaaaaahhh!”
D98 - August 18, 2009
Thanks D98...
You just got me to laugh which, under the circumstances, I didn’t think was possible!
bluekoolaide - August 18, 2009
This
is so dumb.
One of the best GMs in the game is being torn apart by fans that expect perfection. You fools disgust me.
serbianking33 - August 18, 2009
I agree with you solidly
but tonight probably isn’t the right time to be making that point.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Well allow me to retort.
First off, that post is, word for word, from Steve Martin’s “Theodoric of York, Medieval Barber” SNL sketch. For crying out loud.
Secondly, “one of the best GMs in the game”. Seriously? An argument can be made that he is not in the bottom 5… I suppose…. but how can you explain $130+M for this offense? For this roster?
Hendry is going to be fired at the end of this year, and deservedly so. The Cubs will have to spend the next 5 years paying for his mistakes. His era is over, but the hangover is going to SUCK.
D98 - August 18, 2009
You're so wrong on so many levels, D98
but I can’t get totally down on someone who throws in a Theodoric of York reference. Too funny.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
So you're going with "one of the best in the game?"
I can’t even go with “acceptable”, under the circumstances of the contracts he’s thrown around. Colossal wastes of resources.
D98 - August 18, 2009
I'd say so
I think for any other franchise, he’d be lionized.
This franchise … I’m wondering if this job is too big for anybody to handle.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I'm really not seeing it.
For instance, I think he would have been run out of New York or Boston on a rail.
I think that, once again, it gets back to what the fanbase is willing to accept. If you posit that we should be happy with winning the central on occasion and hoping to get lucky in the playoffs, then sure, Hendry has done what is necessary. It helps that the playing field is uneven, and he can outspend his competition by a factor of 5, but that’s neither here nor there.
If the goal is to build a winning organization, Hendry has failed rather spectacularly. The series of free agent busts Hendry has fallen into have resulted in relatively weak 25-man rosters throughout Hendry’s tenure (relative to his peers in payroll), and will seriously hamstring Hendry’s successor over the next 5 years.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Honestly i think this is like the 10th game lou has lost
don’t ask me what other games but it feels like a lot of games.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
I'm not sure how Lou lost this one
But I’ll listen to your explanation, LL.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Because Lou sent Gregg out there
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
Gregg didn't do his job
That’s not on Lou. I wouldn’t be surprised if Gregg gets a “break” from closing for a while, though.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
You asked for his explanation
And I gave it to you. Doesn’t change the fact that Lou is a slow learner.
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
That's not a good explanation
Now, when Gregg blew the save the last game in Florida, I did blame Lou for that. Gregg had just thrown 40-something pitches the night before. He didn’t need to come in.
Tonight? Yeah, Gregg was the main culprit. But drive in a few of those runs earlier and that ninth inning probably plays out differently.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I agree. Gregg didnt pitch well and the team didn't hit. That's not on Lou.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
it's the fact that lou has seen him blown big saves.
Kevin Gregg will never be a good closer. He will be serviceable. He should have made a move way before this .. or at least try some other pitchers.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
and Miles...
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
No one is harder on Lou than me but not this game
Well I think playing Fonty over Baker was pretty bad. I don’t think he had a lot of choice with Miles since Theriot is not available but
Gregg is your closer and that is who you use. Had he gotten the third F*^%$$ing out when he was supposed to we would not be having this discussion so yes poor line up construction is on Lou, acting like a zoned out old man is on Lou but using Gregg is not his fault
UNLESS he does it again .
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
Exactly.
And Lou just said he’ll change the closer.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
Boy this Gregg guy continues to impress
Every move Hendry made this offseason has turned to gold!
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
I defended him for a long time
Then he suddenly reverted back to 2008 Gregg after his return to Florida.
Ace Venom - August 18, 2009
A closer that throws 90 with a hanging curve will always suck
and the GM that signed him does too
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
Amen! Stupidass Lou is just as much to blame for putting his ass out there
and Hendry deserves to be canned for bringing his ass here.
Itchy - August 18, 2009
Hendry should have been canned long long ago
Yet this failure of an organization continues to employ incompetence year after year, why do you think it has been 101 years
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
Another
ignorant comment. Back to back division titles, 3 in 6 years, for a franchise that was associated with losing. Comments like this make me laugh.
serbianking33 - August 18, 2009
Give any poster on this board $130M annually
…and let their teams perform in the last 6 NL Central races, and you’ll see 3 division titles.
Hopefully, said poster won’t puss out on the Carlos Beltran pursuit, and then overcompensate by giving Alfonso Soriano $138 million dollars for his age 31-38 seasons.
Honestly, a great deal of Hendry’s moves seem to have been made on blind faith. Like the naked assumption that Alfonso Soriano could play CF, because he “looks like” he could be a centerfielder. Or the assumption that Kevin Gregg could be an effective closer, because after all, he had 29 saves once.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Beltran
certainly has led the Mets to the promised land, hasn’t he?
Thinking before you post is a vital part of the Internet process.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Beltran has been spectacular for the Mets.
D98 - August 18, 2009
Oh, please
He was having a good year this year until he got hurt, but I wouldn’t call what he’s done in NY “spectacular.”
The only spectacular thing about the Mets has been how spectacularly their seasons have imploded the last three years.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Take another look at those stats.
What is his overall OPS with the Mets? .900?
His first year with the Mets was mediocre. He had those leg issues.
Since then, OPS+ of 150, 126, 129, and 150. That’s spectacular by any standard. A few more years like that and you start calling someone a Hall of Famer.
Heck, a few 150 OPS+ years can get a corner OF into the Hall. For a CF, it’s even more rare.
D98 - August 18, 2009
And the bottom line is
the Mets haven’ t even made the playoffs. By your same standard, he and the rest of the team suck and Minaya is the worst GM in baseball.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
How quickly you forget - The Mets made the NLCS in 2006.
And Beltran was pretty valiant in that series loss to the Cardinals, with an OPS over 1.000.
Beltran is objectively better than Alfonso Soriano at every single skill in baseball. He is a better contact hitter, a better power hitter, a dramatically better fielder at a more valuable position, and a better baserunner.
What, pray tell, is my “standard” for GM performance? I wasn’t aware that I’d set one. I certainly wouldn’t base it entirely upon winning playoff series.
D98 - August 18, 2009
True, that, about 2006
And the last three years, they’ve done squat, and done it in a way that makes the Cubs’ el foldos look amateurish by comparison.
Your standard appears to be exactly that, how you do in the postseason. Are you going to tell me Minaya is a better GM than Hendry is?
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Let's look at that, too
In 06, the mets lost game 7 of the nlcs. The Cubs were horrific.
In 07 and 08, the cubs got swept out of the nlds, while th mets got edged out by the phils. In 07, the cubs were helped by winning a terrible division.
This year, the mets lost essentially every player on their team. And, in all likelihood, both teams will miss the playoffs.
In the last 4 years, it’s advantage mets. Even with the playoff misses in 07-08. It’s cold comfort to point to our zero playoff wins as evidence of superiority.
D98 - August 18, 2009
So I guess
all the Cubs’ injuries this year are some hallucination I’m having? If you’re going to excuse the Mets for their injuries, than you’ve got to excuse the Cubs for theirs, too.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
It's not even remotely similar.
The Mets injury situation has been an order of magnitude worse.
Wright, Reyes, Delgado, Beltran, Castillo, Putz, and that’s just off the top of my head.
D98 - August 18, 2009
I'm still wondering what Hendry saw in him.
I’m sure that, last offseason, the last time Hendry had seen Gregg was when Daryle Ward hit an 8th inning 500-foot 3-run shot off of him.
What caught Hendry’s eye there? Gregg had just lost the set-up role for the Marlins.
“yes sir, that’s my closer! go get him!”
D98 - August 18, 2009
I know!
I wonder if Carlos was supposed to be the closer and Gregg was the backup plan? If not, then Hendry is a bigger idiot than I ever thought.
Itchy - August 18, 2009
No
There was a competition in spring training, and Gregg won it.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
And it was very worrying at the time, imho
eths - August 18, 2009
Hendry is the opposite of King Midas
Everything he touched this season became crappy.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
Ok I am off to take an Ambien
cause I don’t have any valium. Night all.
In the morning I will still have hope because I can’t help myself.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
Looking back at the last 3 or 4 yrs
the double play combo of Roberts/Furcal would look really nice right now. I know i said Roberts … don’t kill me now.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
No way, were so much better off with weak arm singles hitter Theriot and bench player Fontenot
thank god we have a GM who has no clue what he’s doing when it comes to evaluating talent
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
the players they could have gotten for felix pie.....
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
It was all worth it to get Aaron Heilman.
The Best Pitcher Coach Maineri Ever Saw.
D98 - August 18, 2009
seriously they treated pie like god
he turned out like shit and they got shit.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
seriously they treated pie like god
he turned out like shit and they got shit.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
We couldn't spring for $12M for Furcal... and Roberts would have cost us Pie.
So no thank you sir!
D98 - August 18, 2009
and if we signed Furcal Lee would not have been injured and .....
can’t cry of spilled milk and given the way he went to the Dodgers I think Furcal was only using the Cubs to up their offer.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
Last thing before i hit the hay, if this team continues to suck
Hendry and Lou are gone. I’m more certain about Hendry but Lou looks lackadaisical. I can’t wait until this team wins but there’s a part of me that is excited to see a new team with new possible owner.
lexmarklover - August 18, 2009
All Lou will be remembered for when he is gone is failing in the postseason
Division titles mean nothing when you have gone 101 years without a championship, but with all the awful contracts Hendry has given out we wont be contending for a championship for another 3-4 years
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
Late Night with Gordon Twittermeyer...
ballhawk - August 18, 2009
:O
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
A little fuckin late!
Itchy - August 18, 2009
Not really
He’s given Gregg a proper number of chances to right the ship and he hasn’t done it. So it’s a good time to make a change.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
The season is near over, it's a little too late. Actually, way too late.
Gregg has been shaky since day one and other options should’ve been explored months agoincludinga closer by committee, egos be dammed. lou has stuck to the Marol in the 8th, Gregg in the 9th formula way too long.
Itchy - August 18, 2009
oops, I missed a couple spaces there, other options should’ve been explored months ago including a closer by committee, egos be dammed. lou has stuck to the Marol in the 8th, Gregg in the 9th formula way too long.
Itchy - August 18, 2009
Not true
He’s been fine until that Florida series. Not shaky since day one.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
He had allowed more HR than any other closer even before the Florida series.
Gregg was never a good fit as closer. He’s just worse now, when it counts more.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
He hasn't been fine, can't get the death blow, the final strike, that good closers can.
His ERA reflects his crappiness.
Itchy - August 18, 2009
He hasn't been fine the last two weeks or so, no doubt
And if ERAs reflect crappiness, Wood is in that boat, too. Lidge, too, for that mater.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
He's been pretty lousy.
I’ll preface this by saying that, with few exceptions, most relievers can perform adequately in the 9th. Billy Beane learned this, and spent half a decade creating “closers” from thin air and then trading them for legitimate assets.
That being said – 23/29 in save opportunities, the most HR allowed for all closers, 28 ER in 56 IP.
There just really isn’t a lot to point to as evidence of him being “fine”, even prior to the FLA series.
Especially with the gutpunch losses he’s endured this year. The Astros meltdown. The Tigers walkoff. It’s pretty much been a big bag of hurt all year.
D98 - August 18, 2009
By nature, every loss a closer has
is going to be a “gutpunch” loss. That’s part of the job.
And I believe the Cubs won that Astros game, BTW.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
It had better be Guzman and not Marmol
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
could be grabow too
and put gorzilla in the bullpen when z comes back
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
It doesn't matter which loser you put out from this blowpen
The game is over when we send out someone in the 9th
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
Really?
I guess I’ll just chalk that one up to frustration.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
you must have that one on speed-dial.
ballhawk - August 18, 2009
Working OT on that tonight
But someone’s got to keep their head, as hard as it is to do right now. :)
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I'd say more reality than frustration
Most knowledgeable baseball fans knew Gregg was not of closer quality before this year, let alone closer material for a team expecting to contend for a world series after 101 years without a championship, we would have been better off with Kerry this year
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
He's blown five of 15
Not exactly a lot of chances, but not exactly stellar in those chances, either.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Correction
5 of 20. He’s got 15 saves.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I believe it is 6 blown saves after tonight
And that is nowhere near acceptable for a team that is supposed to be contending for a championship, if this team somehow manages to pull something out of their ass and make the playoffs there is no team out there that would be intimidated of that bum coming out onto the mound at any time
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
Wood has blown five of 20
Gregg has blown six of 29.
Listen, we’re all getting our wish. Looks like Guzman is going to close for a while. Let’s see how that goes.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I agree that Wood is no better.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
The other thing about him
is that who knew when his next DL stint would be.
I love Wood, too, but parting ways with him was the right thing to do.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I'll agree with you there
That is if we picked up someone who actually had good stuff in terms of a Closer
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
Wood is pitching in the much tougher AL
I find it hard to believe he would be doing worse than Gregg right now if he were still on the team. The NL central is a joke
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
And the AL Central is Murderer's Row?
That division might be a bigger joke than the NL Central.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
The better question is who do you think would have been better
suited to be closer of this years team, Gregg or Wood
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
What does that mean?
I think it’s six of one, half-a-dozen of the other. What, Wood has some sort of Cubbie Sixth Sense that would make him better suited to be closer here? Now you’re really getting out there.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
I will take Wood over Gregg in the closer role any day, no question
in terms of quality of stuff for that role, I really don’t see how you can disagree with that
CubsBall2202 - August 18, 2009
This is too funny
I’m sure you were saying the same thing when Woody was crapping down his leg the first half of last season.
Methinks Cubs fans have become too whiny for their own good.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
He wouldn't be doing better either.
Last year he did what Gregg did tonight, several times.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
Well crap
Blou and krummy, it sure looks like you guys were right.
joeschmitt - August 18, 2009 via mobile
Have I mentioned before...
I hate the fuckin’ Padres?
And, just as i say this….my PC is acting up…..The Kevin Gregg show has to end. I’ve been trying to post for 15 mins….Lou has beaten me.
It’s such a joy to leave Petco Park on yet, another — another dark night in San Diego.
Just shoot me, stop me from going.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - August 18, 2009
Just got back from the game...
There aren’t words to describe that one. Don’t say anything, just don’t say anything.
That had to be one of the worst “closer” meltdowns I have ever seen, on TV or in person.
Vermont Cubs Fan - August 18, 2009
I was thinking of you.
My sympathies.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
Yeah, no kidding
It was bad enough having to listen to it, let alone watch it.
Interesting two days. Yesterday the Padres closer can’t get the save against the Cardinals, and tonight the Padres win a game the exact same way. If you’re looking at it dispassionately, I guess that’s another example of why baseball is a great game
But, from my vantage point right now, it sucks.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
It was worst being there.
Two rows behind me were Padres fans, one of whom was wearing a “Cubs suck” t-shirt. During the ninth inning, they were trying to provoke me … I ignored them as much as I could.
Vermont Cubs Fan - August 18, 2009
'Cubs suck' -- how clever
I hope PETCO was at least worth the visit.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Petco's fine.
The fans are horrible.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - August 18, 2009
Then, there's always
the chants of “100 more years” when you leave. I never this shit in LA after Cubs losses.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - August 18, 2009
I actually didn't hear those ... I left very quickly after Gregg blew the save (and his job).
Vermont Cubs Fan - August 18, 2009
"hear" this shit....
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - August 18, 2009
I didn't even notice
“hear” was missing, to be honest.
Sounds like quite the baseball inferiority complex in America’s Finest City.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
st louis?
jesus christos - August 18, 2009
Well, that just made me
spit up my Cheerio-s. :) STL does have a big inferiority complex, too.
Funny, when the Cubs were on their big run last season, razzing Cardinals fans was the last thing on my mind. Now, it seems Cardinals fans have nothing better to do than razz Cubs fans. Pathetic.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
4 runs after 2 outs
It’s pretty gruesome, but it’s just another Cubs game in San Diego. I’ve seen it before.
San Diego Smooth Jazz Man - August 18, 2009
I'm really glad I couldn't see it.
sue369 - August 18, 2009
Well, the Cubs will have a new closer, it appears
I suspect it’ll be Guzman. Which is fine with me.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
No word yet on that.
Link.
After what I saw tonight, anyone would be better than Gregg.
Vermont Cubs Fan - August 18, 2009
Funny thing is if Hendry has signed Hoffman
and let Wood go , there would have been howls of anger.
Doggie Stalker - August 18, 2009
There would be howls of anger
no matter what, Jess.
I’m convinced Cubs fans are perpetually angry anymore. I understand it, but it certainly helps take the joy out of watching baseball.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
howls of anger over signing Hoffman?
letting Wood go, sure I understand how that would set some folks off (and it did). But I don’t see how signing Hoffman would have been greeted with jeers and howls.
Sure, at the time, a case could have been made that Hoffman might be past his prime – I seem to recall him getting knocked around pretty good a few times last year when he was still with the Padres. But the guy’s a sure-fire HOFer and the all-time saves leader. Something to be said for having that pedigree on your staff. Worse case scenario – again, at the time – would have been yeah, he doesn’t quite have it anymore but he can help groom Marmol.
ballhawk - August 18, 2009
Well, good night everyone.
I insist, NBF, that to me, the season ended a week ago in Denver. However, I commend you for keeping the faith. I just won’t lose more time watching these chokers at such a late hour. At least I used up some time to pay off some bills while the suckers “played”.
Fraggin Judge - August 18, 2009
Well, you were productive, at least
The season still isn’t over, not by a long shot. But they can’t afford to lose many more like this one.
Good night.
Not Bruce Froemming - August 18, 2009
Good night...
eths - August 18, 2009
Gregg: I believe in my stuff
According to theChicago Tribune.
Boy, I sure wish I had some of what he is taking.
eths - August 18, 2009
How the hell...
…does Dempster let the guy steal 2nd without even looking at him?
That was brutual!
MPH73 - August 18, 2009
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